Q: Are any of your Ns really affectionate, intimate, etc?

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#1 Apr 3 - 6PM

dazed and seeki...

Q: Are any of your Ns really affectionate, intimate, etc?

I've been reading that Ns tend to get scared when they feel that we are getting "too close" to them, so they withdraw. They withhold affection, love and intimacy.

My N is overly affectionate. He wants sex alllll the time. And he is always spewing all of these mushy lovey dovey words. They are so much so that after a while it becomes much. And it certainly seems like he doesn't mean them when they are said so often and in such an extreme manner (and of course, the mere fact that he is an N). But my N is so emotional and so lovey dovery and cries whenever I express that I am done with him.

What is up with this? Is this something that you are also experiencing? I do feel my N withdraw when I ask him too much about himself - like about his childhood, but for the most part he seems to be the opposite of this cold un-intimate animal.

Trust me, he is a narc. I know this. I have been really down for a few days, and have been trying to stay busy with school and catch up which is why I haven't been around much, but I've been going through a series of "low days" after a pretty long streak of good days. Sigh. I can't wait until all of this pain and trying to figure things out go away.

(And I take all blame for not maintaining NC. Just an FYI, while I've been in contact with him, he has promised me the truth, marriage, babies (I didn't ask for these things and do not want these things) - and only yesterday I found out about THREE more women he was fooling around with behind my back while we were dating. This is so ridiculous, I just don't understand where my head was in all of this.)

#2 Apr 4 - 12PM

dudette

perfect

just lovely, the right balance of everything - he was the mature one in charge, I was the young mistress..... but then we were not that often together and I always felt that I never wanted him to see me weak.... after all, he was going through his divorce and I was the angel sent to him to support him through it....sex was a real game of master and servant that I was happy to play... all about the right balance of submission and defiance, which I got perfectly right or so he said.... when we were together he was perfect... well, apart from the bitching about other people that his, and keeping me on tenterhooks a bit.... Until the pregnancy thing and he say me cry for the first time in two years....four weeks later, my mr hyde gave me the silent treatment for the first time and I dumped him 4 days later for the last time....

#3 Apr 4 - 2AM

It'sAllAboutMeNow (not verified)

Yes.. Mine totally was

Yes.. Mine totally was affectionate and attentive. Called and text me throughout the day telling me how much he missed me and loved me. I've never been made to feel so amazing in my entire life. Sex was never crude but it was scarce. I think that's what has been so difficult about getting over him is how amazing he made me feel unless we were fighting. It throws me off sometimes but I know he's an N becaue he lack total and complete empathy, then there's the whole causing fights when we get too close or if I question anything and a I also felt that he did this to make space between so that he could go out and cheat. I know that my attachment to him all come from the good ol trauma bond. Anytime I miss him I just reread what I already know or come to this site.

#4 Apr 4 - 7AM (Reply to #36)

Alisa

Mine was like that too in the

Mine was like that too in the beginning. Made me feel totally special and good, there would be phone calls every night. After we first kissed he told me how much he liked to cuddle. He would hold my hand in public, show all kinds of affection, there would always some form of physical contact between us. We cuddled A LOT, almost too much (can it be too much? Well, he was the total opposite of the BF I had had before him who'd only cuddle as foreplay, so I wasn't used to the affection) He'd buy me dinner, take care of my needs etc. This all lasted for a few weeks, then the D&D started and that was it. When he came back he was like that too, even after the second D&D had begun. Then, some of his taking care of me seemed like he was assuming what my needs were and just acting mechanically. 2 examples: 1)we'd sit in his chilly apartment and I was wearing a few sweaters and was ok. He covered me with a blanket, which may have seemed sweet but he didn't even bother asking if that's what I needed, he just assumed 2) I'd complain about some minor thing and he'd immediately would want to offer a solution although I had said that I already knew how to fix something etc. HIS way was always the better one.

#5 Apr 4 - 11AM (Reply to #37)

dazed and seeki...

Alisa, My N was this way -

Alisa, My N was this way - and this is why I wrote this post. It confuses me. But honestly, it's great to read reminders of the little things that I didn't pick up while I was with him because I wasn't aware of the signs. For example, he totally did the same things your did - like when he was supposedly trying to help me, it always was a big fight because it had to be HIS way. which is odd now that i think back because if the point was to do something for me, and I was expressing that it wasn't right, then he should've listened. But listening was NOT his strong point (

#6 Apr 4 - 11AM (Reply to #38)

Alisa

Yeah, sounds like they were

Yeah, sounds like they were pretty similar. What you wrote in your last paragraph is very similar to how I felt. I must admit that part of me is still looking for a sign he may not be a narc, just like you said. Because him being a narc makes it all so hopeless, like there's no option he might change. It killed me after he broke up with me the first time because I was thinking of all the good times and the fun we had together - just like you are experiencing. I did not understand why suddenly I wasn't good enough for him back then. I am partially grateful that he came back a few months ago and I was able to see the game he was playing. Yes, I was hurt again, but I realized that he doesn't really love me. Somebody on this board said to me (when I was new here and was asking whether or not my ex was a narc) that it really doesn't matter whether he is one or not. How he treats me is what matters and I don't think anyone who loved me would treat me like this. I spoke to a dear friend of mine (he's doing his master's in Psychology) about the whole narc/non-narc issue. He said that it didn't matter how you called it. What mattered, was how the PD was affecting me. I don't know for sure that my ex is suffering from a PD. But I do know that he is extremely self-centered and narcissistic. That his needs come first and that he's not been able to have relationships that lasted longer than a few months. He's 45. I doubt he will change. Also: I gave him a second chance, let him back into my life. He doesn't love me, he probably never did.

#7 Apr 3 - 8PM

dazed and seeki...

Ok, so it sounds like crying,

Ok, so it sounds like crying, mushiness, babytalk, lovey dovey words, etc CAN be a part of narcissistic behavior. So crazy how similar these disordered people are - even when I thought I found a trait that would take him out of the running. Nope.

#8 Apr 4 - 2AM (Reply to #31)

It'sAllAboutMeNow (not verified)

Oh gawd...

Oh gawd.. the baby talk killed me somtimes. He would do it in public and I would be so emabarrassed but of course never said anything. I though it to be so weird becaue he literally acted like a child at times. I mean voice and all. He babied me and I think I fed into this because I lost my dad at a young age and it was like he was giving me something that I was missing. Sounds so absurd not that I think about it.

#9 Apr 4 - 10PM (Reply to #34)

ifinallygotit

itsallaboutmenow - not absurd

We play out unresolved conflicts from out family of origin in our relationships. My Ex N was a big tough macho guy. One day he let his guard down in bed and starting acting sort of like a happy baby or child in my arms - like he really let his intimacy guard down and it freaked me out. i thought this was what i always wanted but I was disgusted by it. I thought maybe I am the one who cannot tolerate intimacy?

#10 Apr 4 - 7AM (Reply to #32)

dazed and seeki...

It'sAllAboutMeNow, this

It'sAllAboutMeNow, this reminds me of how my N would always say how he saw me not only as his gf, but also like his little daughter. he saw his daughter in me. what is this about???!

#11 Apr 4 - 10PM (Reply to #33)

ifinallygotit

dazed

Mine would hold me on his lap like I was his chid. He was very comfortable in this role of intimacy, comforting me - but TOTALLY uncomfortable in a normal man and woman committed relationship

#12 Apr 3 - 8PM

neverlookback

That would

make me want to puke!!!! Sorry to say mine only uttered words of perversion tenderly in my ear when we were intimate, in fact I cant even call it intimacy, it was more fucktimacy,

#13 Apr 3 - 9PM (Reply to #29)

beamoflight

here here!!!

#14 Apr 3 - 8PM (Reply to #27)

dazed and seeki...

Oh when we were having sex,

Oh when we were having sex, mine would be completely crude. But every other time, he was really mushy - but I think only when he wanted something or when he knew he was losing me...

#15 Apr 3 - 8PM (Reply to #28)

JMi

Yep - hoovering sex was

Yep - hoovering sex was always intimate,caring and lovey dovey littered with mushy words D&D sex was always whatever dirt he cud get away with he'd push it as far as possible - and have a horrible look in his eye :( Also snap with the 'held you all nite' card - BULLSHIT! Even if i said i'd been awake all nite whilst he'd slept like a baby he'd claim to have cuddled me all nite long THEN in the next breath say 'u know i can't hold/have you so close to me when i sleep' DICKHEAD

#16 Apr 3 - 7PM

TLSM

Yes. Totally. lovey dovey. smushy baby talk - barf

And it was all bullshit. He is still an asshole and always will be.

#17 Apr 3 - 7PM

goin beyond

Very Intimate but then only at his convenience

The N I was with was very intimate. Never kinky or wierd. I thought this was legitimate love but looking back it may have been lust or chemistry. Our connection was extreme chemistry. I was surprised by it which is probably what kept me under the spell. I really felt he was my prince charming. He really did play the part. But he also would have quiet moods and seemed to have an unhappy demeanor not fully able to experience true joy. This showed up after we married more frequently. I think some of it was repressed anger. Something must have not been "perfect" who knows what...he never would talk about anything. So quiet, introverted, keeping information instead of being forth coming and communicative. It just started looking wierder and wierder. Avoiding eye contact. Go into a rage if I tried to discuss anything. Called me controlling for asking a question. I've never seen anything like it. And believe me in my line of work I work with behaviorally challenged students and I have seen a lot. Anyway...I see so many narc traits now that I have found info regarding it. He sure did think he was god. I know that was the biggest problem. It came out after we married even on our honeymoon he started verbally asaulting me. What a shock. I was so in love with this man like never before. Guess I got sucked in thinking he was something special. He had me convinced till he started abusing me. Long story short...he head butted me, went to jail for a night, I went up and made sure the state dropped charges, he got the best lawyer in town...and he turned into the cruelest person I have ever met. I have been devested. What a shock.

#18 Apr 3 - 11PM (Reply to #23)

ifinallygotit

goin beyond mine was very similar

Minus the violent part - never violent or aggressive ever. Very very affectionate on his own terms the whole 10 years, but very very moody, cold and withdrawn if anything asked of him or we were together because I wanted it or initiated it. The most loving and the least. Did not like to be spooning or wrapped around each other all night - needed space. But sweet before, during and after sex, almost a perfect loving connection. I still don't get how they switch so fast - every morning he would be glad intimacy time was over...

#19 Apr 4 - 2AM (Reply to #24)

It'sAllAboutMeNow (not verified)

Sound like mine...

Sounds like mine... a lot. Except even in the morning he would get up to get ready for work and kiss me. He'd delay getting out of bed to lay with me and be playful. BUT if we had a disput of course it was like he couldn't get rid of me any quicker. Very rude and unconcerned. It's all such a mind screw with these kinds. At least if they were crude all around it would be easier to digest what they are. What paradox of characteristics!! GRRRR.. makes me so angry!

#20 Apr 3 - 6PM

I'sWideOpen

Same

Wow… I was starting to have doubts he is even an N because he was so much so. Mine was extremely affectionate and loving. Cried at the drop of a hat! Yet, the silent treatment came into play just as often as affection and loving did. The last time I left him we were both crying as I packed to leave. I could go into detail here but will make it short as I can. My N was never a yeller or physically abusive. Either loving and affection or the pouting silence? Throw in the subtle criticism, demeaning, demanding of my attention, it’s all your fault thing. Point is I was crushed and sobbing…. Drove away hauling a trailer with some of my belongings hating how I hurt him. Five miles down the road the ties and straps he secured came loose. (same stuff coming from my place to his secured tight.. Like he met this potential accident to happen) I call him , tell him my problem…. He tells me either I can try to fix it myself or come back to the house ( he could of come to me easier) and he’d see what he could do about it. I can’t fix it go back, he comes out, I am still sobbing just as he was when I left. But to my Surprise….. On my return………. Not one tear in his eye only frustration at having to fix my problem! ( I believe he intentionally didn‘t secure this load) That disturbed me… I had suspected all along the tears were only used to make me feel guilty. At this point I knew nothing about NPD so didn’t know I was right about the tears being for him and not me. Hope that makes sense? I am just getting the jest of all this bizarre behavior. That light bulb hanging over my head is getting brighter the longer I am away from him!

#21 Apr 3 - 8PM (Reply to #21)

dazed and seeki...

the thing that weirded me out

the thing that weirded me out was when he would cry and cry and i would feel so terrible, and i would give in to whatever it was, and his eyes would light up immediately. it was like toooo fast - so it make me do a double take. i wish i had known then all that i know now...sigh. but yes! that light bulb sure is getting bright isn't it? :)

#22 Apr 3 - 6PM

Monica

Mine wanted sex all the time but not intimacy

We did not have "normal," intimate sex. I guess I thought that would come...eventually. I realized just before we broke up that it was never going to happen. It would always be porn-style or masturbatory or phone or text sex. It would NEVER be intimate sex. I am not a prude, sexually. Not by any means. I like all kinds of sex. But it has to be BALANCED. There was no balance. I was like a whore (or worse). And I knew that would never, ever change. I do wonder if he was just not able - or willing - to be intimate with ME or if this is how he is/will be with all women. I will never know, nor do I care. I just wonder sometimes. Mine cried, too, when he thought I was going to end it. Crocodile tears. Just to keep me on the hook. He was really good at that. They will show you, tell you whatever it is that will keep you on their hook. And they are good at sounding sincere and honest, blah, blah, blah. I am not buying his crap anymore. Not ever.

#23 Apr 3 - 7PM (Reply to #11)

dazed and seeki...

Actually we were like that

Actually we were like that sexually as well - I felt like a prostitute. i don't remember ever making love to him. And when I brought it up, he got upset and sad and said that he thought every time we did it we were making love. Does he seriously not know the difference??? However, after sex, he liked to lie with me in his arms. I wouldn't say cuddle, because he was usually so tired...yeah, I guess he wasn't "intimate" per se. He did like holding me in his arms and having me physically near, but that was a control thing. And mine cried so much. I guess I'm still trying to accept the fact that they were all fake - an act. I still can't understand how people can live such a fraudulent life and lie so much. I am working on accepting that. But like you, I am not buying his crap ever again. Never ever.

#24 Apr 3 - 8PM (Reply to #19)

Susan32

He compared HIMSELF to a prostitute

What made the ex-Psych prof bizarre were his weird moments of clarity. He'd say he was a prostitute by being a teacher (he was quoting Wittgenstein), that he was prostituting his intellect, profoundly paranoid that I was selling *HIS* lectures. He'd call me a slut if I wore a dress or a skirt (the girlfriend who replaced me was more tomboyish)... but he had no problems saying he saw himself as somehow just acting out other people's fantasies. In my junior year, he said that he was being *PAID* to be my friend because my parents were paying tuition, and somehow I'd have to buy his friendship by getting a paying job instead of volunteering (I volunteered anyhow) Snarkily, I asked how much his friendship cost once I graduated. After the final D&D, he coldly said "I'm a teacher. It's how I make money." He saw it merely as a way of making $$$. Sometimes my classmates said he reminded them of a washed-up prostitute who's hit the bottle too many times&done too many drugs.

#25 Apr 3 - 7PM (Reply to #12)

Monica

Dazed....mine said the same thing!!!

He claimed what we did WAS "making love." It was prostitution-like, pornographic sex, nothing more. Mine also held me in his arms afterward. For a little while. Then he would push me away, roll over, and fall asleep. In the morning he would make a big deal over having "held" me. "I held you in my arms last night, didn't I?" He asked it nearly every time. We didn't live together and didn't always sleep together but, when we did, it was the same thing every time. Like I said, I am not a prude, I just ask for balance. We can do the "kinky" stuff but I also want the true making love stuff once in a while. I NEVER once got it. Not in four years. I don't know if they truly know the difference. Maybe Lisa can shed some light on this?

#26 Apr 3 - 8PM (Reply to #13)

dazed and seeki...

Monica, mine also made a big

Monica, mine also made a big production of "holding" me through the night. But he would be knocked out that he would have had no idea if I had gotten up to leave. And he also asked me if he held me!! And this was the same cycle every single time. In fact our sex was the same so often, that actually "making love" would've been incredibly out of the ordinary and normal to me. His type of sex actually became old. Wow our N's sound soooo similar. Mine was really into fulfilling his fantasy and he always tried to make it sound like it was really for my fantasies. Well, we aren't prudes because we were able to have sex in light of their perversion. Also, mine always made a big deal about how I was the best sex ever. And I know he is lying and says that to every other woman. Ok, scratch that, my N wasn't "intimate" - but he sure made it seem like it by making so much fuss about hugging and holding me. I guess it was to mask the fact that he was just using me for sex. At least a prostitute would've gotten paid for it!

#27 Apr 4 - 2AM (Reply to #18)

dudette

Same here

Absolutely word for word... sickening

#28 Apr 3 - 8PM (Reply to #14)

Monica

Dazed...think how rich we could be lol!!

If I had gotten paid for the stuff he wanted me to do with (TO) him (and I did those things), I would be rich and retiring to an island somewhere, carefree for the rest of my life. Never again. But...truth be told...I am so jaded by xN that I hope I can have a normal, intimate relationship sometime in the future. Right now, I want no relationship with any man whatsoever. He ruined that for me right now. But, I think that is good. I can concentrate on me and my healing and my needs now. Four years of catering to his needs and wants. It is my time now! Ours sound SO much alike. You are right...they made a big deal about hugging and holding to mask using us for sex. mine also would call me after we went out for a drink or dinner or movie (movie only 2-3 times in 9 months) and say, "So, was that a date?" Even if I had paid for whatever we did. He used going out with me in public to mask him using me for his "other" needs, too. If mine slept over at my house, I had coffee, juice and breakfast for him in the morning. He slept in while I went to work. If I slept over at his place, I bought my own coffee and breakfast on my way in to work (while he stayed and slept in). Of course, because I was catering to him, I always told him it was no big deal, not to worry about it, I didn't need him to have coffee and breakfast - not even toast or a bagel - for me. Never, never, never again!!!

#29 Apr 4 - 12AM (Reply to #17)

ifinallygotit

Monica - breakfast

My ex N cooked me nice big breakfasts fairly often (we spent most of our time at his house). Please do not think this fixed any of the emotional problems. He was a better cook than me and could be a nice guy about cooking for me, but he would not speak to me at all during breakfast (after being totally loving the night before) and would then make me feel unwanted like he could not wait for me to leave. its like he would become a stranger again right before I would leave. He would kiss me goodbye and wish me a good day (I worked and he didn't), but it always seemed hollow, like he did not really mean it - emotions were all shut down even though we had just been so close a few hours before - this cycle over and over...

#30 Apr 3 - 8PM (Reply to #15)

dazed and seeki...

Monica, mine ALSO asked me

Monica, mine ALSO asked me "so was that a date?" after we'd do something. I remember bringing up the fact that we didn't really go on "dates" (except for the first few DAYS of courtship when he was pursuing me) - and ever since then everytime we did something, (yes even when I paid!) he would ask me that. I thought it was the strangest thing for him to have to ask that! Did he not know what a "date" was??? I doubt it, because he dated a million women before (and now I'm finding DURING) our relationship. When he became long distance (I moved for school), he started to sense that I was slipping away and started to finally do the things that he never did during the year we lived together - like cooking and taking me out on actual dates. The year that we lived together - he did absolutely NOTHING. When all of my friends were taking me out before I left the city to say goodbye, my N was busy taking out ANOTHER woman on a date. He told me she was "just a friend" - but I don't see her in his life now! God, sometimes hating myself for putting up with all of this is the worst part of all of this. Ours was 2.5 years of hell...and now 4 months of a dragged out recovery process of breaking NC. But I will never allow him in my life again, and I am happy to hear that you will not allow it either! :) He sounds gross (just like mine) and it sounds like you were so giving and catered to him. A normal person would have appreciated it and would have given back. I always remind myself of that. I have never given and catered to somebody so much. The fact that he didn't reciprocate made me start to doubt whether I was giving enough! And that dug the hole bigger and bigger. We deserve better.

#31 Apr 3 - 8PM (Reply to #16)

Monica

Dazed....we Do deserve better!!

But I have to admit that it is scary how alike ours were. They said the same things to us. If he got you to do the things mine got me to do....I truly, truly feel for you. We learned a very hard lesson. But one we will not ever forget.

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