Is the narc hurting ?

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#1 Oct 11 - 1PM
Scoop
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Is the narc hurting ?

"Is he hurting because we have split up ?" That question comes up here all the time and really it is a yes, no answer . He doesnt hurt like we do with a deep emotional pain , that is something they can not feel , but he does feel something if he loses his supply , heres a bit i found on "do narcissist feel emotions ?" and i think it sums it up.

" All humans have emotions. It is how we choose to relate to our emotions that matters. The narcissist tends to repress them so deeply that, for all practical purposes, they play no conscious role in his life and conduct, though they play an extraordinarily large unconscious role in determining both.

The narcissist's positive emotions come bundled with very negative ones. This is the outcome of frustration and the consequent transformations of aggression. This frustration is connected to the Primary Objects of the narcissist's childhood (parents and caregivers).

Instead of being provided with the unconditional love that he craved, the narcissist was subjected to totally unpredictable and inexplicable bouts of temper, rage, searing sentimentality, envy, prodding, infusion of guilt and other unhealthy parental emotions and behaviour patterns.

The narcissist reacted by retreating to his private world, where he is omnipotent and omniscient and, therefore, immune to such vicious vicissitudes. He stashed his vulnerable True Self in a deep mental cellar – and outwardly presented to the world a False Self.

But bundling is far easier than unbundling. The narcissist is unable to evoke positive feelings without provoking negative ones. Gradually, he becomes phobic: afraid to feel anything, lest it be accompanied by fearsome, guilt inducing, anxiety provoking, out of control emotional complements.

He is thus reduced to experiencing dull stirrings in his soul that he identifies to himself and to others as emotions. Even these are felt only in the presence of someone or something capable of providing the narcissist with his badly needed Narcissistic Supply.

Only when the narcissist is in the overvaluation (idealization) phase of his relationships, does he experience the convulsions that he calls "feelings". These are so transient and fake that they are easily replaced by rage, envy and devaluation. The narcissist really recreates the behaviour patterns of his less than ideal Primary Objects.

Deep inside, the narcissist knows that something is amiss. He does not empathise with other people's feelings. Actually, he holds them in contempt and ridicule. He cannot understand how people are so sentimental, so "irrational" (he identifies being rational with being cool headed and cold blooded).

Often the narcissist believes that other people are "faking it", merely aiming to achieve a goal. He is convinced that their "feelings" are grounded in ulterior, non-emotional, motives. He becomes suspicious, embarrassed, feels compelled to avoid emotion-tinged situations, or, worse, experiences surges of almost uncontrollable aggression in the presence of genuinely expressed sentiments. They remind him how imperfect and poorly equipped he is.

The weaker variety of narcissist tries to emulate and simulate "emotions" – or, at least their expression, the external facet (affect). They mimic and replicate the intricate pantomime that they learn to associate with the existence of feelings. But there are no real emotions there, no emotional correlate.

This is empty affect, devoid of emotion. This being so, the narcissist quickly tires of it, becomes impassive and begins to produce inappropriate affect (e.g., he remains indifferent when grief is the normal reaction). The narcissist subjects his feigned emotions to his cognition. He "decides" that it is appropriate to feel so and so. His "emotions" are invariably the result of analysis, goal setting and planning.

He substitutes "remembering" for "sensing". He relegates his bodily sensations, feelings and emotions to a kind of a memory vault. The short and medium-term memory is exclusively used to store his reactions to his (actual and potential) Narcissistic Supply Sources.

He reacts only to such sources. The narcissist finds it hard to remember or recreate what he ostensibly - though ostentatiously - "felt" (even a short while back) towards a Narcissistic Supply Source once it has ceased to be one. In his attempts to recall his feelings, he draws a mental blank.

It is not that narcissists are incapable of expressing what we would tend to classify as "extreme emotional reactions". They mourn and grieve, rage and smile, excessively "love" and "care". But this is precisely what sets them apart: this rapid movement from one emotional extreme to another and the fact that they never occupy the emotional middle ground.

The narcissist is especially "emotional" when weaned off his drug of Narcissistic Supply. Breaking a habit is always difficult – especially one that defines (and generates) oneself. Getting rid of an addiction is doubly taxing. The narcissist misidentifies these crises with an emotional depth and his self-conviction is so immense, that he mostly succeeds to delude his environment, as well. But a narcissistic crisis (losing a Source of Narcissistic Supply, obtaining an alternative one, moving from one Narcissistic Pathological Space to another) – must never be confused with the real thing, which the narcissist never experiences: emotions.

Many narcissists have "emotional resonance tables". They use words as others use algebraic signs: with meticulousness, with caution, with the precision of the artisan. They sculpt in words the fine tuned reverberations of pain and love and fear. It is the mathematics of emotional grammar, the geometry of the syntax of passions. Devoid of all emotions, narcissists closely monitor people's reactions and adjust their verbal choices accordingly, until their vocabulary resembles that of their listeners. This is as close as narcissists get to empathy.

To summarise, the emotional life of the narcissist is colourless and eventless, as rigidly blind as his disorder, as dead as he. He does feel rage and hurt and inordinate humiliation, envy and fear. These are very dominant, prevalent and recurrent hues in the canvass of his emotional existence. But there is nothing there except these atavistic gut reactions.

Whatever it is that the narcissist experiences as emotions he experiences in reaction to slights and injuries, real or imagined. His emotions are all reactive, not active. He feels insulted – he sulks. He feels devalued – he rages. He feels ignored – he pouts. He feels humiliated – he lashes out. He feels threatened – he fears. He feels adored – he basks in glory. He is virulently envious of one and all.

The narcissist can appreciate beauty but in a cerebral, cold and "mathematical" way. Many have no mature, adult sex drive to speak of. Their emotional landscape is dim and grey, as though through a glass darkly.

Many narcissists can intelligently discuss those emotions never experienced by them – like empathy, or love – because they make it a point to read a lot and to communicate with people who claim to be experiencing them. Thus, they gradually construct working hypotheses as to what people feel. As far as the narcissist is concerned, it is pointless to try to really understand emotions – but at least these models he does form allow him to better predict people's behaviours and adjust to them.

Narcissists are not envious of others for having emotions. They disdain feelings and sentimental people because they find them to be weak and vulnerable and they deride human frailties and vulnerabilities. Such derision makes the narcissist feel superior and is probably the ossified remains of a defence mechanism gone awry.

Narcissists are afraid of pain. It is the pebble in their Indra's Net – lift it and the whole net moves. Their pains do not come isolated – they constitute families of anguish, tribes of hurt, whole races of agony. The narcissist cannot experience them separately – only collectively.

Narcissism is an effort to contain the ominous onslaught of stale negative emotions, repressed rage, a child's injuries.

Pathological narcissism is useful – this is why it is so resilient and resistant to change. When it is "invented" by the tormented individual, it enhances his functionality and makes life bearable for him. Because it is so successful, it attains religious dimensions – it become rigid, doctrinaire, automatic and ritualistic.

In other words, pathological narcissism becomes a PATTERN of behaviour. This rigidity is like an outer shell, an exoskeleton. It constrains the narcissist and limits him. It is often prohibitive and inhibitive. As a result, the narcissist is afraid to do certain things. He is injured or humiliated when forced to engage in certain activities. He reacts with rage when the mental edifice underlying his disorder is subjected to scrutiny and criticism – no matter how benign.

Narcissism is ridiculous. Narcissists are pompous, grandiose, repulsive and contradictory. There is a serious mismatch between who they really are, their true accomplishments, and how they regard themselves. The narcissist doesn't merely THINK that he is far superior to others. The perception of his superiority is ingrained in him, it is a part of his every mental cell, an all-pervasive sensation, an instinct and a drive.

He feels that he is entitled to special treatment and to outstanding consideration because he is such a unique specimen. He knows this to be true – the same way one knows that one is surrounded by air. It is an integral part of his identity. More integral to him than his body.

This opens a gap – rather, an abyss – between the narcissist and other humans. Because he considers himself so special and so superior, he has no way of knowing how it is to be human, neither the inclination to explore it. In other words, the narcissist cannot and will not empathise.

Can you empathise with an ant? Empathy implies identity or equality with the empathized, both abhorrent to the narcissist. And being perceived by the narcissist to be so inferior, people are reduced to cartoonish, two-dimensional representations of functions. They become instrumental, or useful, or functional, or entertaining, gratifying or infuriating, frustrating or accommodating objects – rather than loving or emotionally responsive.

It leads to ruthlessness and exploitativeness. Narcissists are not "evil" – actually, the narcissist considers himself to be a good person. Many narcissists help people, professionally, or voluntarily. But narcissists are indifferent. They couldn't care less. They help people because it is a way to secure attention, gratitude, adulation and admiration. And because it is the fastest and surest way to get rid of them and their incessant nagging.

The narcissist may realise these unpleasant truths cognitively – but there is no corresponding emotional reaction (emotional correlate) to this realisation. There is no resonance. It is like reading a boring users' manual pertaining to a computer you do not even own. There is no insight, no assimilation of these truths.

Still, to further insulate himself from the improbable possibility of confronting the gulf between reality and grandiose fantasy (the Grandiosity Gap) – the narcissist comes up with the most elaborate mental structure, replete with mechanisms, levers, switches and flickering alarm lights.

Narcissism Isolates the narcissist from the pain of facing reality and allows him to inhabit the fantasyland of ideal perfection and brilliance."

Big love Scoop x

Oct 12 - 1PM
Journey
Journey's picture

Fantastic article Scoop!

Fantastic article Scoop! This described my exN so well, it actually sparked empathy for him in my eyes. For all that he seems to be happy and carefree moving on the way he does while discarding those close to him... I know he is really not happy and does not know how it feels to be content because after the initial excited and 'happy' phase of supply satisfaction, it always comes back to a restlessness boredom and need to replace that with new supply. I may have more emotional 'hurts' than him, but I would never prefer to be in his shoes.

Journey on...

Oct 13 - 1PM (Reply to #23)
Scoop
Scoop's picture

You can say that again

You can say that again Journey , fancy never being happy , the closes they get to it is idealization which can leave them at any time , they can get up in the morning and ZAP the idealization has gone and they are back to flatline again , its no life . xx
Oct 12 - 1PM
tresor2
tresor2's picture

Excellent article, Scoop,

but, in my mind based on my experience, they don't hurt at all. Mine published a book bragging about how he always had 2 - 3 women at the same time, keeping him from ever feeling anything should one leave. If I told you what the book was about, you'ld be shocked; a total hypocrite. People are objects to them, period. Now he lives with someone which is a bit confusing. Maybe he does finally care about that one...who knows. There must be something special or he wouldn't have given up his freedom. It's all so sickening. Thanks Scoop, I'm going to save this article/post...
Oct 13 - 9AM (Reply to #19)
Susan32
Susan32's picture

Giving up his freedom

The ex-Psych prof would always describe marriage&childrearing as slavery. He'd quote Leo Tolstoy who said that women take revenge on men who use them as sex objects by "chaining them in bonds of sensuality" and keeping men from being productive. He'd talk about how men lose their ability to produce the moment they reproduce. As well as his incredible hatred of children. So I was shocked, in a sense, after the final D&D (a brutal&public one) when I learned he was married&had kids. Did he "give up his freedom"?I doubt it. It was all about IMAGE. Looking like the Healthy Family Man, rather than a Creepy Professor who Preys on Students (he had a circle of devoted male student groupies)
Oct 13 - 1PM (Reply to #20)
Scoop
Scoop's picture

Susan your professor was a

Susan your professor was a nut job !
Oct 13 - 1PM (Reply to #21)
Susan32
Susan32's picture

That's why there's abnormal psychology

He's a professor... but he'd be fine as a case study. Once he hinted that he was put in a New England mental hospital. One of them (Worcester State) is used by UMass Memorial Medical psychology interns... and a graduate wrote a coffee table book of abandoned asylums titled "Asylum." In a twisted way, he's probably helped students get their majors in psychology. Unfortunately, my college didn't offer that major :(
Oct 12 - 10PM (Reply to #16)
Journey
Journey's picture

"There must be something

"There must be something special or he wouldn't have given up his freedom" Ya, that's what I thought when my exN moved in with me. From there everything in my life (after the initial month or two of 'honeymoon') went steadily down hill as he began the next (and way worse than the previous one when I could still reclaim my space and independence, devalue phase). I was the one who lost my freedom - my freedom to take care of myself emotionally. With his constant presence and influence, I became a shadow of my former self. I got lost in the dream of intermittent closeness and his emotional control gripped tighter. Trust me Tresor2, you are very lucky NOT to have been the one he allowed into his 'castle'. (hugs)

Journey on...

Oct 12 - 11PM (Reply to #17)
tresor2
tresor2's picture

Thanks for the reinforcement, Journey

and I'm sorry for what you went through...hope you are out of it or working towards that. I've been alone for a long time and I think that's one of the reasons I get stuck with warped thinking. That's the part of my healing I'm working on; changing the distorted belief that living in peace is for everyone but me (it's a childhood thing, lol). And you're so right in pointing out that WE loose our freedom and here I'm woried about him losing his. Glad you brought that up. Today, I received Kaleah LaRoche's newsletter and she writes some pretty good stuff...here is the latest on Grieving Consciously in case you haven't read it. http://www.narcissismfree.com/blog/?p=467
Oct 13 - 2PM (Reply to #18)
Journey
Journey's picture

No worries Tresnor, I've been

No worries Tresnor, I've been out of my R for over two years. I'm glad I could help shift your perspective. xo

Journey on...

Oct 12 - 1PM (Reply to #12)
Used
Used's picture

HE hasent given up his

HE hasent given up his freedom,he has just found a place to lay his head, he has probley 3/4 on the go....then when he gets fed up ,or they get demanding ....HE GOES HOME TO MOTHER...
Oct 13 - 4PM (Reply to #15)
into the light
into the light's picture

Oh yes. Home to mother every

Oh yes. Home to mother every weekend. Now he's moved in with her while waiting to set up home with new woman. Creepy, creepy, creepy.
Oct 12 - 2PM (Reply to #13)
tresor2
tresor2's picture

Funny...that's about it, Used.

Actually, he "allowed" someone to move into his castle with him. He's wealthy and lives in a great city...he has the "good life" to offer in terms of that. We know what the flipside is...
Oct 12 - 2PM (Reply to #14)
Used
Used's picture

haha, yes his surrogate

haha, yes his surrogate mum.....
Oct 12 - 1PM (Reply to #7)
TNR1
TNR1's picture

Just because he is living

Just because he is living with someone..don't think for a minute that he is giving up his freedom. He probably still has some girls on the side. He is just being more secretive about it.
Oct 12 - 2PM (Reply to #8)
tresor2
tresor2's picture

You're right, TNR1,

as a matter of fact, before I knew he was living with someone, I was seeing him. One lie after another. He's a pro at cheating, two wives left him behind his wandering, plus he travels all over, making it so easy not to get caught. Still, whomever it is, has something he wants/needs...enough to where he wants to be with her every day.
Oct 12 - 5PM (Reply to #9)
TNR1
TNR1's picture

Still, whomever it is, has

Still, whomever it is, has something he wants/needs...enough to where he wants to be with her every day. Wow....sounds to me like you are envious. Why?? Narcs love to give off the impression that they have everything the world expects of them...so yes, sometimes they will live with someone...but that just means that person is someone he wants to live with (for now). Over time the D&D will begin and we'll see how long that lasts. I was the OW...I used to be sooooooo jealous of the gf because I wanted the opportunity to have Mr. N come home to me every day. I wanted to meet his friends, family. I wanted to go out to movies...eat dinner together....spend time with him. I realize that we tell ourselves the grass is greener on the other side when really..there is no greener side with an N. Everyone involved is just an object that the N uses.
Oct 12 - 5PM (Reply to #10)
tresor2
tresor2's picture

Yes, TNR, there's definately

still a part of me that's envious...maybe it's the competitive side of me. I'm dealing with the pain and I do sometimes struggle with the green grass/lucky OW syndrome. Then I think about that article, "So You Think He'll Be Different With Her" and I come back to reality. I know you understand exactly where I am, based on your prior experiences as the OW. They make us feel not good enough because they selected another...but, in fact, maybe we are the lucky ones. What we're going through is bad enough and probably would have been even worse if we lived with them, who knows. Several people have suggested I'm lucky and maybe that's true. We can't always get what we want, as the song goes.
Oct 12 - 10PM (Reply to #11)
TNR1
TNR1's picture

Oh...believe me....I know

Oh...believe me....I know exactly where you are coming from....but here is the deal. No one is good enough for the N...not for the long term anyways. After reading story after story from ex gfs and wives...I realize that my envy and jealousy are misguided. In the end, we are all simply objects with roles that fit what the N wants us to be and we deserve so much better than that. I know it's hard...but turn the tables around....he wasn't good enough for you. You, who are full of life and love could not have tolerated such a dull and emotionless man for long. Because you are no longer constrained by an empty shell of a man...you are now free to find someone who can truly see and love you...not just love your "parts" but love all of you.
Oct 12 - 12PM
TNR1
TNR1's picture

Wow....

Such a good article...I recognize Mr. N throughout it. No wonder I felt like an object with him...that is exactly what I was...a compliant object. It speaks volumes to the inability of anyone to have a "relationship" with a Narc.
Oct 12 - 11AM
TNR1
TNR1's picture

Somehow I hit the submit

Somehow I hit the submit button twice. :)
Oct 12 - 8AM
How could I
How could I's picture

Fabulous info Scoop

Fabulous info Scoop! So many light bulbs went off for me while reading this. Thanks for sharing this valuable information!!!!
Oct 12 - 1AM
ifinallygotit
ifinallygotit's picture

wow!

heavy stuff but very helpful - thanks, it really helps me understand and try to take it less personally...
Oct 12 - 1AM
Sea
Sea's picture

Thanks again Scoop!

Love this one! "He is thus reduced to experiencing dull stirrings in his soul that he identifies to himself and to others as emotions. " This one is true, my exN admitted to this, in his own words he said "dull stirrings"!