Self doubt - is he really a Narcissist?

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#1 Jun 24 - 3PM
Amy
Amy's picture

Self doubt - is he really a Narcissist?

So I have been asking myself "is he really a narcissist or am I reading to much and trying to put him in that box"? Mind you - I have no interest in getting back with him. Just wondering if I was over-analyzing.

Granted - the therapist I went to in 2007 said he was a narcissist and she predicted his behaviors (and they came true 4 months later).

I went to therapy for the 1st time since 2007 today. New therapist. I just want to make sure I don't repeat this with anyone else. I was really happy when I left - I didn't cry a tear. And when I discussed the whole thing, it was like looking at myself as a different person. I am so emotionally disconnected from him now that I am not sad, or even ANGRY anymore. :-) Yay me!

So I told the new therapist that I have done a lot of reading, told him abt this site, etc. I told him I thought maybe he really wasn't an N because:

- He got very sad and emotional when we broke up and said he "couldn't imagine life without me". Tears, snot, the whole thing.

- He wasn't financially stingy, and he didn't expect em to buy things for him or anything (in fact - he wouldn't let me pay for things most of the time).

- We never got married or lived together (though we lived close and he controlled me from afar).

Other stuff I can't think of at the moment...

He said he thinks the ex BF is a narcissist based on some of what I told him (and it was fairly brief). He also said that just because he was emotional, that doesn't mean anything - said he was sad for him, not me and that not all narcissists get married and expect to have things purchased for them... He said I was probably expected to provide other things for him (very true).

So all in all - a very good day. I am glad I went. I feel so good that I was not sad or crying or ANGRY! I mean - what a change from 6 months ago!

Amy :-)

Jun 26 - 12AM
Lisa E. Scott
Lisa E. Scott's picture

Amy

Amy, I'm glad you had such a good day Wednesday! You must feel really good about how far you've come and you should. I agree with everyone's comments. It doesn't matter how many of the traits he has, just one is bad enough. Congratulations on your new found freedom!
Jun 26 - 1AM (Reply to #10)
Marie
Marie's picture

Doubts

Amy, Don't look back and doubt anything. If having doubts begin a journal now and start listing behaviors so you don't forget. When things started getting messy and I found myself making more and more excuses for his behaviors I started my journal. I'm so glad I did. A few times when he would come back all moody and weepy I took him back like a fool because I was so in love with him only to have him turn cold once more. The last time I sent him packing because the patterns are so clear in the journal. I also see now what a phony and liar he is. Don't think tears mean anything, the words I've found certainly don't. On one hand he's told me how I'm the only woman for him but have caught him messaging others. The emotions they show are fake, everything about them is fake, the only thing real is the pain they leave in their wake. Stay happy and free don't look back, don't regret or doubt. After a year of wavering I'm finally regaining my freedom but still have a lot of anger. Anger at him for what he did and anger at myself for not getting out sooner and allowing the abuse. Be well!
Jun 24 - 6PM
Barbara (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

finallydone

Lisa's book is brilliant in giving real life, well described examples. I recommend it. You can also read my story on this site ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Free articles & information for abuse victims: http://abusesanctuary.blogspot.com Effective Coaching for Victims of Pathologicals http://one2one4victims.webs.com/
Jun 24 - 3PM
Barbara (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

amy

do NOT doubt yourself and your instincts. women have a nasty habit of saying - gee he only has 8 of the 12 bad traits. Sheesh - TWO WOULD BE ENOUGH!!! Lisa's book is a very good read if you want to know if he's a narc. I recommend getting it. She gives great real-life examples. ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Free articles & information for abuse victims: http://abusesanctuary.blogspot.com Effective Coaching for Victims of Pathologicals http://one2one4victims.webs.com/
Jun 24 - 4PM (Reply to #6)
suzanne
suzanne's picture

THE BOOK

Wish I could buy it...how the hell would I read it in the same house? Are you kidding?
Jun 24 - 4PM (Reply to #7)
Barbara (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

suzanne

I hid my books before I left. Or start making your plan to get out! ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Free articles & information for abuse victims: http://abusesanctuary.blogspot.com Effective Coaching for Victims of Pathologicals http://one2one4victims.webs.com/
Jun 24 - 3PM (Reply to #2)
Amy
Amy's picture

Thanks...

Thank you Barbara. Was just a bit worried about it... I am on Amazon now getting the book. Amy :-)
Jun 24 - 3PM (Reply to #3)
Barbara (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

is he really a narcissist?

more: Is your partner a narcissist? You may not know how to tell, but even worse, you may be thinking that you are the crazy one. Narcissists work hard to distort our reality to make their reality feel safer. So what is a narcissist? Someone who preens in front of the mirror all day in admiration? NOT! Ask yourself this: is your partner intensely angered by anything that seems to suggest that he or she might have a flaw? Narcissists will do anything, including brutalizing their own family, to maintain their own feeling that others see them as without any flaws. And, narcissists have extreme and illogical sensitivities, sometimes connecting the most minute observations with their intense fears of being seen as flawed. Narcissists will strain every muscle to meet their own "flawless" image, and demean or destroy anyone or anything who casts any doubt on this image. If you see this dynamic in your partner, family member, coworker, or friend, you are very probably dealing with a narcissist. For many of us, struggling to live with this kind of abusive partner, the first handhold we need to grasp is that we are not crazy. Whether the person we live with has narcissistic personality disorder, borderline personality disorder, antisocial personality disorder/ sociopathy, or alcoholism, people who suffer from these disorders have extreme emotions, which lead them to actions that can range from puzzling to brutal. Living with them is painful and confusing. Personality disorders are aptly named, because the minds of people who suffer from these disorders work differently than healthy people. It is only by understanding how you and your partner function, how his or her personality disorder affects his or her behavior, and how you interact, that you can begin to really judge what is happening. To figure out what you should do, you need to understand your own emotions and how to handle the decisions you face. Tears and Healing (up top) deals with your situation, while Meaning from Madness (on the right) explains a disordered partner. Both are written by a man who survived a violent relationship with a narcissistic/ borderline/ alcoholic wife and has been engaged helping others through these situations for the past 6 years. They Spin our Reality: Disordered people can't deal with the reality of their behaviors. On some level they realize how hurtful they are, yet accepting this major flaw in themselves is just too painful. So disordered abusers spin our reality to make theirs less painful. One of the most common defense mechanism they use is projection. In projection, a characteristic of themselves that they find just too painful to accept is projected onto us. And the most frequently projected characteristic is mental illness. "I'm not a narcissist. You're the crazy one." Another common and difficult defense mechanism is blame shifting. It's your fault this happened because blah, blah blah blah... After a while it becomes hard to distinguish what is real from what is being projected and what is being distorted. We begin to doubt our reality and question whether we're the crazy ones, or whether our disordered SO's (significant others) are really right about what they say. The truth is, THEY'RE NOT RIGHT. But they feel better when they can get us to carry the burden of their illness and their behavior. What's more, disordered people hide their problems very effectively. People with all of these personality disorders - narcissistic personality disorder, borderline personality disorder, and antisocial personality disorder - have serious maladjustments in coping with life. Thus, they live in emotional turmoil. They seek to present a very together appearance, hiding their disease from most people. It is only when we get into a close and private relationship with someone with these personality disorders that the abusive behavior comes out. And because their lives are wracked with emotional turmoil, there is a lot of pent-up emotion that can be focused on us. Yet those around us don't see it, causing us further confusion. The different disorders have different underlying themes. People suffering from narcissistic personality disorder respond with extreme defensive actions to events which they feel threaten their perception as special and privileged. Similarly, those suffering with borderline personality disorder respond to some events with extreme fear of abandonment - events that would have little meaning to a healthy person. Those with antisocial personality disorder lack normal feelings of responsibility and compassion and thus have little motivation to restrain their reactions. And alcoholics can show any of these, while at the same time their natural inhibitions from hurtful behavior are suppressed by the intoxication. All of this leads a lot of confusion for those of us unlucky enough to be in committed relationships with someone with a personality disorder. My own experience was with someone who probably would have barely diagnosed at her worst - and definitely not at her best - with borderline personality disorder. What I have learned, as I have begun helping people with broader experiences, is that much of what I learned about abuse and borderline personality disorder also applies to narcissistic personality disorder and even antisocial personality disorder. Another thing I've observed over time is the link to alcoholism. AA and Al-Anon have a culture that treats alcoholism as a disease alone and apart. Thus, people getting support through these channels tend to think that there is nothing more to learn beyond alcoholism. At the same time, this approach leaves some things unexplained. They talk about "dry drunks" and problems that persist long after alcoholics get sober. Why is this so? If addictive use of alcohol is the problem, why don't things improve when the alcohol abuse stops? The reality is more likely that alcoholism and other addictions, like pot/marijuana, prescriptions drugs, cocaine, etc, are the result of a personality disorder. In the case of my ex-wife, a mixed addictions to alcohol and prescription psych meds was the result of self-medication to deal with the emotional pain of her disorder. Addiction is extremely toxic, and greatly worsens the effects of a personality disorder. But if the substance abuse stops, the underlying personality disorder is still there. Thus, it's essential to understand how a partner with narcissistic personality disorder, borderline personality disorder, sociopathy/antisocial personality disorder, alcoholism, or substance abuse will interact with us - if we are to get a handle on our situations and our own lives. And to begin with, we have to realize that even though we are victims of a prolonged distortion campaign and may feel very confused about things, WE ARE NOT CRAZY. http://tearsandhealing.com/narcissistic-personality-disorder5.htm ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Free articles & information for abuse victims: http://abusesanctuary.blogspot.com Effective Coaching for Victims of Pathologicals http://one2one4victims.webs.com/
Jun 24 - 4PM (Reply to #4)
quietude (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

is he really?

Actually, I was relieved in a way to find out my ex was a narcissist. I was a very bittersweet thing. He is definitely at the 'less psychotic end' of the spectrum in my opinion, but it doesn't matter, he still IS one. And just a FEW of the traits is enough to nearly drive you to insanity. For example, mine needed constant reassurance. He was completely emotionally draining...I got e-mails ALL THE TIME, EVERY DAY containing crap like "I worry I'm not good enough of a man for you, I hope I'm okay sexually, I worry that you've been with others who are better, I am so lost, I am so sad, I don't want my sadness to becomes yours, I hope I can live up to the man you need - you deserve so much, I never want to disappoint you, you're the only woman I've been this remotely close to, I never want to lose you". This is ONE of some N traits he had...and this one I really despise because it took so much time & energy - and not the productive kind, because it never would have mattered how much I reassured him...which was all the damn time. I always thought, he must love me to open up like this, at the same time I thought, I wish he'd realize I love him and he need not worry about everything so much. Point is, just having a couple of traits are enough to make you think you're the crazy one and there must be something wrong with you if he's obsessive about these things.
Jun 24 - 5PM (Reply to #5)
finallydone
finallydone's picture

Wow

We need real life examples to keep being shared. I find them to be the most helpful. Many of the books (although all helpful and validating) do describe more of an entire monster which can make it hard to relate when we're all dealing with whole flesh and blood people. Sometimes they're quite human and that's what makes it so easy to sit outside of it and think "maybe it was me sometimes... maybe I was too hard on him... I'm not perfect either." And then I start thinking I should call or write again or something. It's easy to get weak. It's those real life examples (like quietude's above about all the e-mails and their content) that make me say to myself. "YEP! EXACTLY LIKE THAT. THAT'S WHAT HE DID TO ME TOO!