Narcissism -- overlooked issues

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#1 Jul 6 - 11PM

Anonymous (not verified)

Narcissism -- overlooked issues

There are likely predisposing neurological factors involved with just not giving a shit about the feelings of others. Bu it seems to me narcissism is also created moment by moment by the narcissist by choosing callousness over kindness; by placing a higher priority on dominance than on empathy. It's as much of a choice as it is a biochemical or emotional reality. When you objectify others you effectively "desoul" them...and that has a whole spiritual dimension overlooked by psychologists who are schooled in behaviourism which is of course part of material scientism.

There's just a whole other dimension to this problem we aren't entirely on top of, confined as we are to 3 dimensions in space time. Every time we get closer to understanding it, in all of it's ramification "an angel gets her wings!" LOL!

#2 Jul 7 - 4PM

coffeeaddict66

Spirital Aspect

I have to agree with you and I think you have touched on a really important aspect that we don't spend much time considering since we are so consumed with the pain of our situations. I don't want to offend anyone and I am a Christian. I personally have found myself realizing that there is a real aspect of evil involved here. Evil thrives on the ability to confuse and deceive. It is also very subtle (boiling frog). I have realized looking back over the past several years of this roller coaster relationship that I have compromised my values, beliefs and let go of the boundaries and limits I used to live by. I have spent a large amount of time reviewing what I truely believe in and what i have tolerated and never would have even considered putting up with before I met him. Satan, evil or how ever you want to describe it, is most effective when the change to the dark side can be made slowly. That is what happened for me. I am now finding that I have rediscovered my boundaries and why they are important to me. I have more confidence and am feeling better every day. I know now no matter what I could never re-enter a relationship with him, no matter what. I am actually happier deep in my heart than I have been for a long time. This comes from being at peace with myself because I am not putting up with this evil in my life. I am sleeping better, have more energy, not overeating. Sure, I have moments of loneliness and sadness but it is getting easier to distract myself with more productive things. Thank you again for your comment, I think this is a powerful aspect that we don't always consider. Maybe it's a form of "spiritual warfare". We have to decide what we believe and return to it stronger than ever. A true "good" person would never cause us or ask us to compromise our beliefs or violate our boundaries. What is wrong here is him and the damage that has been done to our life because of him and the impact he has had on us. There is no good in that and that is the truth we have to face. There is no way to dress that up and make it acceptable. Choose good. Pray hard. Get your values and boundaries back. We will all come out better when we turn away from evil.

#3 Jul 7 - 7PM (Reply to #10)

enpsychopedia r... (not verified)

The psychopath/malignant narc

The psychopath/malignant narc embodies the trickster. The trickster may be an agent of evolutionary emotional and intellectual change, by forcing us to embrace 2 opposing realities; that the universe is both unfriendly AND friendly. Most people fall squarely in one camp or the other. The secret is to be able to tolerate enough ambiguity that we are able to greet the day and new people while nestled comfortably on middle ground. It's not about the futile exercise of trying to resolve opposites or cognitive dissonance-- It's about what happens to our mental and emotional processes with others, AFTER we have been through this mind blowing experience. Narcissists are simply BAD. Period. Now we know they are out there. We can become more cautious, wiser, compassionate and intellectually agile. That's personal evolution in the mundane realm that has profound spiritual implications. We can also become bitter and paranoid. The potential for both is there. One is evolutionary. The other, sadly, is devolutionary. In fact, we can easily end up becoming more like the narcissist or psychopath himself. In religious texts it talks about Satan winning converts over to his side. Surely, this is one of the ways. C.S.Lewis, in "Screwtape proposes a toast" gets right into the epistemology of it, in a beautiful way. In terms of a purely mental and emotional exercise, psychopaths force us to think about thought itself as a form of self defence. That experience can best be visualized in Eischer like reiterations. We aren't just thinking about what we are thinking and what the other person is thinking in any given social interaction. We become accustomed to thinking about what they are thinking about what we are thinking about what they are thinking, etc.. etc... It's taking "theory of mind" one step further...and that is brain evolution. We gain insight into the covert, into stealth, into mimicry, etc...We are engaged in seeing through camoflage in the jungle of greater society. Who knows, maybe the loss we experience is offset by what we gain. The searing psychic pain represents death but we may be growing new neuronal structures. We have literally and in a material organic way, been pushed to and beyond the limits. We are evolving. And God, doesn't it hurt?

#4 Jul 7 - 4PM (Reply to #7)

dolphingirl

spiritual help

I agree that there is evil at work with the narc, and I try to remember that it is the narc-himself that suffers most. of course this is hard to beleive because they seem so confident, willful and calculated in their lies, deciet and manipulation. I know in my heart that as much harm as I endured with him, the divine light of love is still alive, and available to me.

#5 Jul 7 - 4PM (Reply to #8)

coffeeaddict66

Divine light of love

I agree love is still there for us, and within boundaries and goodness it will be better than ever when the time comes and it will. We were distracted for a season by someone/something that is incapable of understanding what real love is. We have learned and continue to learn and grow so that we may be more mature, stronger and properly value and appreciate new love when we are blessed with it.

#6 Jul 7 - 4PM (Reply to #9)

dolphingirl

Thank You coffeeaddict

Inspired words, thank you, blessings

#7 Jul 7 - 2PM

dolphingirl

the dark narc

I appreciate your contemplating the more spiritual and soul-ful aspects of narcs I have been wondering about this myself. I consider myself a spiritual person and wanted to be forgiving and kind. This was of course used against me and caused me a lot of pain. I sometimes feel that the narcs personality is spiritual-death, the soul is dormant, pushed aside and a monster surfaces in its place intent on destruction. A darkness overshadowing any light. its a nice thought to think that when the narc is revealed and called what it is, an angel gains it wings- thank you

#8 Jul 7 - 8PM (Reply to #5)

enpsychopedia r... (not verified)

Good point!

Thanks so much, Dolphin girl. I appreciate your thoughts here too, (as well as everyone else who responded) Yes, our goodness, mercy and compassion can and will be used against us by psychopaths/narcissists. Why even some common goofball/idiot/dorks can take our greatest strengths and negate them.

#9 Jul 7 - 8AM

Goldie

I hear ya

I believe that it is primarily environmental with the Narcs and while it is predominately male in nature, yes there are female narcs, however females tend to be more histrionic or borderline. Therefore there must be something in the male biological makeup which makes them more susceptible. Also we have learned that environmental stimuli can actually change the brain chemistry which would make it a more permanent condition. I just noticed that the word perMANent contains the word MAN, LOL. I don't believe for one second that this is a choice for them. They don't choose to be assholes; they just are assholes. They have a brain which tells them to put themselves first and any degree of change is only for manipulative purposes. Who would chose this insanity? They are NOT happy people, not by any stretch. They are compelled to act this way. This is their nature. They are disordered and DO NOT think as we do, therefore they do not react as we do because the thought proceeds the deed. Psychopaths have been found to have a different brain make up so obviously with them it is not choice. I believe we will one day find that Narcs do as well, it is just not as easy to see or find as with the Antisocials. Just my opinion from years of research on this subject. I could be wrong and as you say we will find out more as time goes on. God bless, Goldie

#10 Jul 7 - 8PM (Reply to #2)

enpsychopedia r... (not verified)

redundant

redundant. Woops

#11 Jul 7 - 9PM (Reply to #3)

Redhead1

My own thought is that thier

My own thought is that thier childhood did this. I think stress can alter anyones brain. I would have never guess that I would become trauma bonded to my narc. I have so much sense when it comes to toxic people, unless I love them. Nobody at my work would guess my narc did the things to me that he done.There were childhood issues that cause me to trauma bond to him. I had abandoment issues, except mine made me desperately seek and please for thier love instead of trick, abuse or manipulate them for it. I do not believe in genetic personality disorders, I believe they are learned. I believe mental illness is genetic. My narc is just like his dad. His dad is just like his dad's mother. Its just like a cycle, generation through generation until hopefully it is broken. Its kinda like these families who have and have had generations on welfare. They know no different if they have never been taught. By chance, one generation sees a better way and explores it. They may not get it early on in life and they may not make it totally out, but they can teach thier offspring and hopefully the next generations will evolve more and more. That is just my thought at the moment.:)

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