The myth of No Contact

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#1 Jun 27 - 12AM

girlfriday

The myth of No Contact

I found a brilliant article online that really resonates with me. It's about No Contact and discusses how this has to be an organic decision rather than something forced right off the bat as a cure.

I will post the link below, but this is the last paragraph:
"I believe that healing from trauma is a process of transformation, and cannot be forced, willed or manipulated. "No contact" has grown into a huge, mythological chimera that claims to cure most ills. It doesn't. It's only a part of the equation."

Once again, I have to compare our "being hoovered" to the alcoholic not being able to resist a drink.
You can tell an alcoholic "DON'T DRINK DON'T DRINK DON'T DRINK" all day, or force them into rehab, but until he/she is ready, the abstinence will most likely not take.
I believe it's the same for many of us who can't let go of an unhealthy relationship, and that reading "NO CONTACT NO CONTACT NO CONTACT" over and over and over isn't the answer. It's a goal, however... when one is ready for it.

Here is the url:

http://narcissism-support.blogspot.com/2009/01/loving-narcissists-and-my...

#2 Jul 9 - 6PM

WantMyLifeBack

This article really really

This article really really stuck with me because I have broken up with my N numerous times and really only made one I guess maybe two serious attempts at no contact. When you've been brainwashed for so long and lost so much of yourself it really is hard to explain or even understand why you can't just leave. I have friends that look at me like I have 2 heads because I used to be such a strong person who would NEVER EVER in a million years take this crap. And yet still here I am. The last time I went no contact was earlier this year. I really had to build myself up to it and wrap my head around every bad scenario he could throw at me and I did it. No screaming, no crying, no begging. I just did it. When I talked to him I tried to minimize any blame towards him because I didn't want it to be about that. I didn't want to get drawn into the conversation of telling him what a bastard he really is, so I made it about him. I told him it wasn't fair to him for us to be together because I was never going to be able to "get it right". It wasn't fair to him to be mad all the time because of me and my inadequacies, etc. I told him it wasn't about me dating anyone else. I was happy to just be by myself. It actually threw him off and he really didn't have a response. Until I ended up in the hospital and like an idiot I texted him. We started talking and I don't even remember how I got sucked back in. Now its just as bad if not worse than before. I regret not being 100% ready to go NC and getting sucked back in. I really feel like I set myself back and its made my depression worse than before. I actually feel more numb than anything else. Some days I just don't care either way.

#3 Jul 9 - 7PM (Reply to #29)

NancyM

WantMyLifeBack

I am going to be really blunt here because I think you need to hear it. I know where you are coming from because I have done that exact same thing that you have described. Do you understand that you are DYING? You are in that place where you don't care anymore and you HAVE to get out, even if you can only muster the energy to crawl away, you have to do it. From here your body is going to start shutting down...your immune system will go first...your thyroid is probably already all over the place. Then you will get sick all the time, and probably result in cancer or some equally debilitating disease. You MUST get out NOW!! Every minute you stay will make the escape harder. You can't wait for a day when you may feel stronger, because even if you have one of those days, you are more than likely to waste the energy on trying harder. Please please get out NOW!

Nevergoback

#4 Jul 9 - 8PM (Reply to #30)

WantMyLifeBack

I know have to sever this

I know have to sever this relationship. Every rational part of me tells me that. This whole thing is completely insane. Reading everyone's words gives me strength that I know I need to do the right thing. Nancy your words register with EVERY LOGICAL part of my brain. The only saving grace is that we don't live together. THANK GOD!! Its one of the few things that I have always refused to give in to is actually living with him.

#5 Jul 9 - 8PM (Reply to #31)

NancyM

Being logical

I know what your saying...I refused to live with mine for the last 18 months of the relationship, I only had a vague understanding of narcissism, and my logic saw what was happening, but I still went into shutdown, I had all the symptoms. Glad to say 5 months NC I have no more symptoms. I know it is hard to get your head around this stuff, but that can also keep the cycle going. If your not living with him now, it will be a little easier for you not having to move etc when you finally decide NC. I only say a little because we all understand how hard it is no matter what the situation. Good luck. ((HUGS))

Nevergoback

#6 Jul 9 - 8PM (Reply to #32)

WantMyLifeBack

Thanks so much Nancy xoxoxo

#7 Jun 28 - 9AM

NinjaGirl

NC became very easy for me

Once I read those words from him: "I know I miss having a girlfriend, but I'm not certain that you're the one I want to be with." My pride would absolutely not let me contact him after that. Sometimes it takes anger and acceptance that it's really over, or a desire for the pain and cycle of torment to be truly over, before you're ready to go NC. Thankfully, I apparently have an easy-to-reach spite/anger button that he finally triggered.

#8 Jun 28 - 8AM

stillsinging

great post thank u

I read this a while ago and it totally resonated with me too, but then I could n't find it so thank you. i totally agree that nc is not necessarily a cure all and there after all degrees of narcissm. i am certainly looking at the difference between what he says and what he does and weighing it all up. already i am stronger taking less shit, if ijust went NC I would have additional bad feelings to deal with. great to see this, i got a lot of flack on here for even trying to discuss the concept of nc

#9 Jun 28 - 11AM (Reply to #26)

Janet

I kept going back for more

I kept going back for more abuse. Finally, in Dec. he had me come over to tell me he was sleeping with someone else. It was someone he knew from about a 5 years earlier and she comes from a very rich and famous family. I was so devastated, he actually recoiled when I wanted to kiss him goodbye though my tears. That was it, just too cruel. I did not know about N/Ps yet, so there were about 5 more email interactions in February - but he is still with her so very cocky and mean. Have not seen him or talked to him since that night in Dec. It takes a lot of time to get past this kind of abuse. Peace. J

Peace. J

#10 Jun 27 - 8PM

James (not verified)

Great thread

"The more you get to know what they're doing, what they are really like, see it for yourself with a clear eye, the more you observe and catalogue, the greater becomes the desire to not inhabit the narcissist's planet any longer." Great thread! This statement really hit home for me and how it explains when NC becomes possible and promising for a victim. Only when we fully understand and see with a "clear eye" how the relationship (if one can call it that?) has been based on an illusion(s) and not a real emotionally and physical bonding between two people, then and only then can one understand relate and fully comprehend the need and desirer of one's own NC. It's this statement by the writer that has in fact allowed me total NC and allows me to keep it day by day week by week month by month and then year by year. It's been 3 years and each year looks feels and on my part of belief expects to be better as each day passes. Giving up NC is now much like giving up a part of my individual soul. Something as a Christian I have no right to do. http://james-personalitydisorder.blogspot.com/

#11 Jun 28 - 7AM (Reply to #22)

baddream

So true-- James

I tried (unsuccessfully) so many times over the years to go NC but found myself on the d&d, NC, going back to him roller coaster. I could not stop the cycle, even though I was so miserable and anxiety ridden all the time. The defining moment for me was finding a forum on which narcissists posted, reading their posts, and finally seeing and internalizing how evil they really are. I had to hear it from them to understand how they see us. As supply sources to be measured against other supply sources. Disposable. Things. After this I was repelled. You have to WANT No Contact for it to be successful. I have not been in contact with him for over a year because I now know I do not want him in any part of my life. It is a difficult journey from the moment you suspect you are with a narcissist to the point where you accept it and make the decision to do something about it. The realization seems impossible at first because the truth of what they are is so grotesque and goes against human nature. We are not socialized to understand that some people do not have a soul, and it is a grievous process to realize we have been in love with someone who is a poseur. Once we see the truth, as you say, "NC becomes possible and promising for the victim". James-- I am happy for your healing journey.

#12 Jun 28 - 7PM (Reply to #23)

loveofmylife

baddream

What was that website?

#13 Jun 28 - 8PM (Reply to #24)

baddream

Website- loveofmylife

Here is a link to the Narcissist Psych Forum. There is a mix of people here, those seeking help from their relationship with an N, and Narcissists. There are all kinds of discussions. Spend some time on the site-- it is interesting, disturbing (and sometimes very enlightening) to read N's responses and posts. http://www.psychforums.com/narcissistic-personality/

#14 Jun 27 - 2PM

Lisa E. Scott

girlfriday

"I think once you see the truth, realize what they are, what you have experienced, you want to go NC." This is such a good point, GIJ!

#15 Jun 27 - 1PM

for some of us..

NC is not possible because of children. So the best we can do is MC "minimal contact". It's tough because they use the children to get reaction from you. "You need to say hi to me in front of our child." "You need to be cordial to me in front of our child & her teachers." No, I "need" to only send you emails regarding the logistics of our child.

#16 Jun 27 - 11AM

Susan32

Why I went NC

After I found out he already had a girlfriend (and blamed me for "putting him in an awkward position"), I started giving him the silent treatment. I'd give him the cold shoulder... or tell him to man up and take responsibility. I'd either be ignoring him or telling him off. I called him a lying, arrogant bully. I have never been so cold to anyone. Before the NC, I had let him give me a personal recommendation for a teacher education program in the Southwest. Several weeks into it, I got a late night call from one of my professors telling me NOT to come back, NOT to tell anyone, and that I was a "danger to children." I still think my ex-P pulled that in a pathetic way to get attention. My friends came to the SAME CONCLUSION independently (because one of them was, and still is, on the East Coast) I didn't come to him in begging and admiration. I didn't confront him angrily. I went NC. When I've read that NC hurts Ns and Ps, yes, I did do it to hurt him. On purpose. It was a narcissistic injury, but it was an injury nonetheless. Only now I've read how cutting off NS (Narcissistic Supply) causes forms of dysphoria and depression.

#17 Jun 27 - 6PM (Reply to #14)

Monica

"I have never been so cold to anyone."

They bring out the absolutely worst in us. I can say the same. I have never, ever been so cold to anyone in my entire life (and I am in my 40's). No one has ever caused me to react in the ways I have reacted to my xN/P, caused me to say the things I said to him, brought out such anger, spite, hatefulness, jealousy, frustration...all the worst in me. I didn't even know that this was inside of me, never had a clue. Wow...this is the first time I have really thought about this. I am not saying that it was unjustified...it certainly was justified. It's just that no one ever made me act and react the way he did.

#18 Jun 28 - 1AM (Reply to #18)

Susan32

Bringing out the worst

My ex-P is NC with me... well, it could be because his Daddy lives with him, raises his kids, and knows how he's screwed with other people's lives. I'm sure my ex-P probably told him, coldly, how he dealt with a "troublesome" former student by nearly wrecking her professionally. Let's remember how my ex-P's childhood alma mater was Worcester State (NOT a college) Oh, and it got colder... the December after graduation, I sent ALL of my former professors nice thank-you/merry Christmas cards. Except my ex-P. Sorta reminds you of being picked last for playground games. Oh, the irony... I went on to be a teacher in another state, and quit after 18 months BECAUSE I GOT ANOTHER JOB OFFER. My former supervisors thought that not only I was NOT "dangerous to children",but that I was GREAT with them. Another irony... I was the youngest, least experienced, yet I was assigned the MOST to an autistic student. Somehow, I was able to reach the autistic student. I was able to see how he thought, how he was isolated in his own thinking, fixated on dinosaurs. Interestingly, psychopaths and autism sufferers have commonalities--the lack of mirror neurons for empathy. Except autism sufferers are more likely to be victims than predators. My ex-P being lost in his fantasy world... not THAT different from an autistic boy fantasizing about dinosaurs.

#19 Jun 28 - 1AM (Reply to #16)

Janet

I am horrified at some of

I am horrified at some of the things I said and the way I acted. I too am in my 40s and this was something new, and which I never want to repeat. Peace. J

Peace. J

#20 Jun 28 - 1AM (Reply to #17)

loveofmylife

Same here

in my mid 40s and have done things I have NEVER done before - like read someone's email because I had to know the truth! Along with getting into arguments and I never argue. Why do they bring these things out of us? Is it just pure frustration that we know we are being lied to and from them being so evasive? Or feeling like we have to fight back against the abuse? LIke we aren't just going to sit there and take day after day of verbal abuse and belittling?

#21 Jun 27 - 8PM (Reply to #15)

James (not verified)

Monica

"all the worst in me. I didn't even know that this was inside of me, never had a clue." Interesting statement but I too wonder if all these "feeling" are part of us or was projected upon us? Which is why I relate so to this song and had to add it to my blog. http://alturl.com/yhxb

#22 Jun 27 - 11AM

loveofmylife

Amen

What a great posting, thank you so much. I felt very forced to go NC when I couldn't due to a business contract and if I broke the contract it could result in losing my business funding, which is in essence putting lots of people out of a job and closing a 25 year old business. When I joined this board, I had been in love with my N for 23 years! 22 1/2 years of absolute bliss where I thought he was the most amazing thing in the world. Loved him to the bone, he treated me like a queen, he was always there for me, I connected to him more than anyone, he was a pure gentleman to me and helped me in all aspects of my life. And had been 4 months into D&D. With that kind of an investment in someone, NC wouldn't work for me because I still needed to logically process what had happened and felt loyal to that very, very long close relationship and at least owed figuring it all out! Was this a truly disordered person or a person who reacted badly to some stressful circumstances? And because of my logical mind, like this article said, I felt like I needed to see more evidence to truly internalize what he was, to get rid of some of the ambiguity so that NC was an organic decision based on what I know to be true. Not a forced one, which I know would throw me into perpetual obsession, since it would be hard to get rid of THE ONE unless I truly internalized that he was NOT THE ONE. I think it has just taken me longer since the "honeymoon" phase was 22.5 years!

#23 Jun 29 - 1AM (Reply to #12)

TexN (not verified)

save yourselves

When I first joined this forum, I was completely lost. I knew nothing about narcissism. A lady by the named of Barbara always responded to my postings (as well as everyone elses). She had so much knowledge & information to share. She didn't always tell me what I wanted to hear & she sometimes was pretty stern with me. But with her guidance, continuous advice of keeping "no contact", & tough love, I can honestly say I wouldn't be where I am today. I can still hear her say, "They are not human", "Get a tougher lawyer", "Get a counselor that gets it about Ns/Ps", "Absolute no contact". Barbara didn't read or write a book about N/P's, she & Narcnarc LIVED IT! For them, I am truly thankful that they shared their experience & advice with all of us. It saddens me that you new ladies will not get the opportunity to know these two wonderful ladies & share with them your stories cos you would have learned more than you could have ever learned from anyone else on this board. I have seen some pretty nasty and slanderous things posted here about Barbara... and they remain. Anything bad about the board owner, however, disappears almost immediately. Anyone who has anything bad to say about Barbara or NarcNarc seems to have the board owner's ear; even if it is not true. Yet no where online have I seen Barbara say a BAD WORD about this board, its owner or anyone else. Probably because she's got ethics! And 2 psychologists who were members here were accused of not being PhDs and made fun of. Another 2 people with ethics that were literally bullied off this board. This is no longer a place of healing - but a place to feed another person's denial and gossip. I would not be free from my N/P if these two ladies had not given me the tools. Through the persistent nudge from Barbara, I went and hired a tougher lawyer & my exN/P signed his rights over, my dd has a good counselor -- because of Barbara... Thanks to GOD: Barbara, Narcnarc & all the wonderful ladies that cared enough to give advice... I am truly saved and so is my child & I GET IT NOW. My advice to you is... Go somewhere where people will be REAL with you. Stop hoping for the impossible! Stop wasting your life! It's not going to happen...

#24 Jun 27 - 11AM (Reply to #11)

Janet

Wow, a 22.5 year honeymoon

Wow, a 22.5 year honeymoon phase must be truly mind blowing. I am reeling from 4 years with this guy, where the honeymoon phase was pretty volatile and unkind. Understanding what they are is important to make sense of the madness. Sheeeeesh. Peace. J

Peace. J

#25 Jun 27 - 11AM

GIJ

Agree on NC being a decision

When I was at my peak of cognitive dissonance, I would have not been able to go NC. I was confronted with hard truth that I wanted to ignore but couldn't, even as more information (truth) presented itself. I felt compelled to get to the bottom of what was going on. I knew something just wasn't right. I lost ambition, motivation, creativity. I didn't recognize myself. Once I learned about narcs, and what I had been experiencing, NC was a no brainer for me. Googleing evil and narcissist led me here and other sites. I couldn't explain what was happening. I was confused and not able to function in ways that I know I am capable of. I needed to know what to do. These sites led me to truth and information I could no longer ignore. I had lots of "good" in my head about my narc (not to mention altered brain chemistry and mind control), so it took lots of "bad" experience to change my perception, along with a description of narcs and the impact they have. It took a lot of courage for me to face the truth. That was actually harder than going NC. I think once you see the truth, realize what they are, what you have experienced, you want to go NC. At least I did. It was liberating to see I had options. I found it to be empowering. However in my learning stage, I needed to learn I had options. It never occurred to me I had options. I was confused and needed to be jarred awake to the reality that I was engaged with a narc. And being used and played, brainwashed with NLP and programmed. I saw the NO CONTACT repetitive message as the path out of hell. I trusted the people posting knew what they were talking about given their experience. So the repetition of it sunk in over a few days and gave me the courage to make the decision and just do it.

#26 Jun 27 - 4AM

MissM

That explains it. At last.

In almost a year if no contact (that he imposed on me) that finally explains why I've never felt grateful or better or better off thru NC. I still have occasional thoughts that he might text me still after nearly a year, and I confess that in that moment I feel elated and relieved. It's only then that I see how very depressed and changed NC has left me. Scoop is right, NC feels right when it's your mind you're trying to salvage, not your when it's been imposed on you. I'm under no illusion tho that eventually I'd have had lost my marbles staying with him. But I needed to find that out for myself, I needed to see him and talk to him and he took that from me by cutting me out of his life. The pain hasn't gone, it's just been numbed and there isn't a day I don't think about him.

#27 Jun 27 - 4PM (Reply to #7)

smileyfacepr

me too!!

I think about hom all the time everyday..even if hes in the back of my head..but hes there! He went NC so then so did I, I could have called but chose to have some self respect for once w/him! I still 1 yr later wish hed call or text or show up at my door..although I do not know what I would do...I miss him but after 1 yr I dont know if Id take him back, I think taking him back would be going back to the same life we had b4 because I know that if in 7 yrs he only got worse then he will only continue to get worse as he ages he 15 yrs my senior almost 58 yrs old!! I still feel I love him but I also think maybe I need to c him in person to really know! Sometimes u c them and then go..what the hell was I thinking and suffering for??? But I do miss his wonderful touch and kisses and love making..it wasnt all bad!!!

smileyfacepr

#28 Jun 27 - 4PM (Reply to #8)

Janet

As suggested on many sites,

As suggested on many sites, I have been writing down all of the rotten things he did, the unpleasant side of me he brought out, and the really bad times we had. After the final D&D where he was just so mean, I still focused on how much I loved him and what fun we had. Really doing my best to stop that kind of thinking and remember the bad times instead. They are not okay and a life with them is really not okay. Peace. J

Peace. J

#29 Jun 27 - 8AM (Reply to #4)

TNR1

I understand....

I'm in the same boat. I haven't heard from Mr. N since the end of April. I stopped texting him a few days later under the advisement of friends who said that if he wanted to be with me, he would contact me. He didn't. I just got back from a trip and was secretly hoping I'd have a text, but there was nothing. I have good days where I can put it all in perspective and there are times that I break down and cry for want of him. I am jealous of those that hear from their exNs because I'd love the chance to hear Mr. N's voice just one more time. I go through "what if" scenarios in my mind although I know that is fruitless. For me, it is the equivilent of trying to go cold turkey after being hooked on him for 2 yrs. Withdrawal stinks.

#30 Jun 27 - 5PM (Reply to #5)

aceonelady

TNR1

i am with you on this same boat...Just how i feel...like a crackhead forced into withdrawing from The Drug...i crave for it knowing it is killing me already...is a double sided sword....Damn if i do damn if i don.t...is a rotten way to live...He went NC on me a year ago...and i did broke it several times.not gaining anything absolutely from it...could only see how far out he is getting while time goes by...he is angrier.nastier and bitter...Well at least i am seeing things as they really are now...

Aceonelady

#31 Jun 28 - 12PM (Reply to #6)

hitandrun

Me too, feel like a drug addict

That's what it feels like I would imagine, like withdrawing from a heavy duty drug like heroin. NC is like going cold turkey from a drug. A constant craving. Sometimes you break down and use. But for me, the drug never reciprocates...never contacts me or responds. One day this monkey will be off my back.

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