Is it really the Narc's fault? Or ours?

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#1 Jan 21 - 12PM

Jackie

Is it really the Narc's fault? Or ours?

I am posting this to give strength to everyone who is struggling with Cognitive Dissonance!

I disconnected myself by loving myself more! I drew strength from myself in knowing that "I am going to be okay". So I got involved with Narcs. I have forgiven myself and the key was acceptance. Accepting the emotional and verbal abuse that my ex Narcs put me through. Was it all their fault? I have accepted that it is not all their fault! I ALLOWED IT! Once I accepted that and quit blaming them...I grew stronger and looked into myself, did hypnotherapy to deal with my demons in my subconscious, and have emerged stronger than I have ever been!

So about a week ago, my last ex Narc contacted me. I hesitated to answer his call. Nonetheless, I did, and agreed to meet him. During the course of our meeting. My mind was more in tune with analyzing him. It was quite the eye opener! It was like watching a spoiled child. He tried all the things in the past that would get my sympathy. I read him like a book! It was quite amusing to say the least...I am still just shaking my head wondering what the hell did I see in him? I can do soooo much better! He is now someone else's problem...not mine!

I accepted and forgave myself for the abuse I allowed! But no more! I love myself and feel so EMPOWERED now that I have won! He can no longer abuse me because I won't allow it! I am in control of my life and emotions..not him!

#2 Jan 23 - 9AM

IncognitoBurrito

Along

Along these same lines, I wonder. What is the N's responsibility? Are they to completely avoid any and all relationships, knowing full well the extent of their disorder, and what they're capable of? Is that a possibility for them? Although, that would require some speck of altruism, which wouldn't gel with how Ns/Ps operate, anyway. Just talking out loud, sorry.

#3 Jan 23 - 9AM (Reply to #21)

midnight7

That would require an ounce

That would require an ounce of self-awareness - they didn't get that gene! Why would they give up - they get everything so easily and they don't feel anything - guilt/remorse/empathy. They appropriate relationships/sex/funds quickly, destroy people at will, and can apparently come back and do it all again - in some cases years later.

#4 Jan 22 - 9PM

Journey

That's great news! I applaud

That's great news! I applaud your taking responsibility for the part you played and congratulate you for your new found clarity. There are way too many of us who blame ourselves, too much, too often though, so I want to add that it is NOT our fault the narc is a narc or that he abuses. It is NOT our fault that we believed lies disguised with love, trust, goodness, passion - that we believed in the person and relationship that we THOUGHT was real. We need to build back our self esteem and know our boundaries, that is true, but we are not all codependent, nor is this always about some prior wound that needed healing which attracts us to dysfunction. Like a frog who will slowly boil to death if placed in a pot of water and then gradually turning up the heat, if the water was boiling when he got in, he would have hopped right back out and saved himself. Sometimes narcs slowly become covertly abusive behind a very convincing, manipulating and controlled mask of normalcy. Just sayin'

Journey on...

#5 Jan 22 - 1PM

Snowflake

Loved this topic post

And everyones ideas/thoughts. I think its a bit of both ie if you have never seen a spider you wont know it might bite you. However the first time it bites you, you know to stay away. I personally think a lot of us on here have co dependancy issues, trying to heal people issues, dont want to see reality, too easy to forgive whatever..things that need work on. So prob a bit of both x

#6 Jan 22 - 7PM (Reply to #18)

Jackie

Topic Post

Snowflake..that a very healthy attitude to have! :)

#7 Jan 21 - 5PM

ruby01 (not verified)

Jackie

I just don't want to see people beating themselves up and blaming themselves for being victimized by a manipulating abuser. It can and probably will happen to everyone on some level throughout their life. That's what causes us to become aware and become more introspective. If we do not then we would remain stuck. You took the pain that you experienced and took a deeper look into the matter and regained control of your life. I have nothing but respect for you and the courage you have.

#8 Jan 21 - 6PM (Reply to #16)

Jackie

Forgive yourself is key to a healthy you!

Ruby01. I know what you meant by not wanting others to beat themselves up for getting involved with a Narc. However, healing is also forgiving yourself. Forgiveness sets you free, it enables you to let go instead of carrying the burden! I firstly accepted what I allowed and ignored, and then forgave myself! I know it sounds simple...I can't explain how this all happened except the audio hypnotherapy worked because that is when I started to notice the change in me! Some of the audio hypnotherapy I listened to and still do was: detachment, forgiveness, jealously, positive thinking, and letting go of the past! My last Narc had me literally thinking I was crazy with a chemical imbalance, I was making excuses for his abuse on me, I was going to counselling, etc. I believed the shit! Counselling was telling me what I knew consciously so I decided to work on my subconscious mind~ Thank God! I truly feel for everyone as I have been thru it 3 times, and each encounter was worse because my self esteem was already damaged and just continued to get damaged with each encounter! Let me tell you..there is no fun in being locked in a closet for a day and then accepting that it was my fault (this was the first Narc)! What was I thinking? So then I get involved with another..who was worse, etc. It has taken me 41 years to finally get it! Better late then never tho!

#9 Jan 21 - 5PM

jackguy

cruelty is the responsibility

of the person inflicting it...abuse is the abuser's fault...our issues which may often exist are separate...they may make us tolerate abuse for a period of time but the impulse toward cruelty and the act of carrying it out belong ENTIRELY to them...I meet vulnerable people all the time...I'm not cruel to them

#10 Jan 21 - 6PM (Reply to #12)

Jackie

There will always be abusers!

Jackguy...there will always be abusers..so why do we have to allow ourselves to dance with them? We have a choice...Knowledge is Power! We have to love ourselves enough to see abusers for who they are before we accept their invitation to dance right?

#11 Jan 22 - 1PM (Reply to #13)

jackguy

true jackie

i know that i had/have issues that made me vulnerable to abuse and that in dealing with those i personally will not be susceptible to abuse...but the abuse originates in the psyche of the abuser... I had weak boundaries, unmet childhood needs, an unrealistic view of myself and of the abuser...I know that..but that does not change where the responsibility lies...they sense our weak boundaries and target us specifically because of them...don't underestimate the intent, even if it isn't explicitly an intent to harm...it is an intent to own a person that exists in the narc...

#12 Jan 22 - 7PM (Reply to #14)

Jackie

Responsibility vs. Acceptance

Hi Jackguy... I agree to an extent that the abusers are responsibly but there is no use beating our heads trying to get them to admit! The key I found is to realize and accept my issues - I have control over me...I don't have control over abusers. It took me to dig deep, but all in all...I have been working on them and I think positive now! No more negative thinking...the negative thinking keeps them in control of you still!

#13 Jan 21 - 5PM

IncognitoBurrito

Wonderful

This is a wonderful post, thanks for this. I think sometimes it's a matter of trickery and shadiness, on Ns part. Sometimes it's just the law of the universe, and like attracts like. That will always be. Overall, I'd say most of the blame can fall squarely on the N, because they were the ones perpetuating their agenda, and saying all the things we wanted to hear, to lure us in deeper. We didn't know they weren't being upfront. I am responsible for my own actions, though. As such, it's my lesson to learn. Ultimately, there were old patterns from family, through childhood, that I took with me, and continued into adulthood. I'm responsible for that, and I'm responsible for my own recovery. Whether I was hoodwinked or not, I didn't maintain proper boundaries, and I didn't stop it. I'm still learning that saying,"No." isn't an abomination, and doesn't render me automatically dispensable to others. I can have boundaries and value at the same time. It's not required of me to be useful, in order to be loved. That was an old belief I carried with me subconsciously. You know what? No, N should've said from the get-go not to wait around for him. I wasted so much time. Time that I can't get back now. It's not his fault I didn't appreciate my own value. But it IS his fault for stringing me along, to boost his image and ego. I'm all over the place, this is a good one. Makes you wonder...

#14 Jan 21 - 6PM (Reply to #10)

Jackie

Boundaries

IncognitoBurrito...you said it! BOUNDARIES I never had boundaries..which is why I was a doormat. I have been practicing boundaries, and it feels great! I know what I will allow and won't allow. Narcs have no boundaries..they don't care how their actions or in actions will affect people = especially their partners... I had no boundaries, so I accepted abuse for fear of rejection. The thing is that all along it made me feel horrible because I didn't like the treatment but could not establish boundaries as I did not know how. Gotta learn boundaries everyone!

#15 Jan 21 - 4PM

ruby01 (not verified)

Jackie

I think you can pretty much put the blame where it belongs- 100% on the abuser! You were unaware at the time. If you were to accept it from this point on you would then be a volunteer, seeing as you are now able to spot their tactics and protect yourself.

#16 Jan 21 - 5PM (Reply to #8)

Jackie

Ruby01

Ruby01, I accept my role...I allowed it! No one put a gun to my head and said you have to be abused! I have accepted the whole ordeals, and forgiven myself, and moved on taking what I have went thru as a learning experience! Narcs blame everyone for everything! I am not about to be a blamer as well! I put my big girl panties on, dusted myself off, and have made it my mission to make choices in my life for a better life! No feeling sorry for myself because I allowed someone to abuse me! I worked on my self esteem which was obviously lacking otherwise, the Narcs would not have been able to brainwash me! As I said below...there were "red flags" which I chose to ignore! I now ask alot of questions to men I date, and see what their answers are!

#17 Jan 21 - 2PM

NarcJunkie

Wow, Jackie, that is awesome!

High five to you!!! :) I surely hope that if I ever run across the Narc again I will feel exactly like that! I love it how you saw him as a spoilt child and "read him like a book". I guess I kind of experienced that during my last Narc encounter a few months ago. I could see through him, but the pain was still too present for the whole thing to strike me as amusing. Owning our own part in this and loving ourselves unconditionally truly is the key Here's a link that greatly helped me to stop the blaming and cog diss: http://www.ehow.com/how_4818960_not-love-naricissitic-personality-disorder.html "When you date a narcissist, they can be very charming and this is a trap. It's really up to you to avoid this trap because the narcissist can't help it. This is an incurable untreatable personality disorder. If you run across a spider who bites you, you can't blame the spider. It's your job to avoid the spider as best you can."

#18 Jan 21 - 4PM (Reply to #5)

ruby01 (not verified)

NarcJunkie

If you run across a spider who bites you, you can't blame the spider. It's your job to avoid the spider as best you can." What about the first time you come across a spider and you don't know anything about them?

#19 Jan 21 - 4PM (Reply to #6)

Jackie

Learn!

Yes, you never know until you have encountered a Narc...however, in all honesty, there were "red flags" when you really start to examine your encounter! I have been thru 3 of them so far...and up until the 3rd I did not know about NPD. That being said, why the hell did I put up with the abuse and ignore the "red flags"? For me, it stemmed with my self esteem! Can I blame them for my lack of love for myself? No...I was a willing participant! Accept, forgive yourself, love yourself, and learn a lesson! Life is too short to let an encounter(s) ruin your life! Life is a Gift!

#20 Jan 21 - 2PM (Reply to #4)

Jackie

Great Article

Great article! It is so right! We are in control of our lives and the people we allow to enter! This was a gift we were given when we were given life! We are only on this wonderful earth once...so let's all make it a helluva journey with good and bad chapters...and make the choice to end it on a good positive chapter and reflect on the bad chapters as learning experiences which have made us the person we are today! And I tend to laugh as well at the bad chapters now! Silly Silly me..but life goes on! Narcjunkie...you will feel like that, sounds like you are well on your way! You have to accept your role, and who they are! Yes, there will be many other women after you or there was during you...but there is nothing you can do! Accept and forgive yourself, love yourself more, and move on..so that true love will find you! Meanwhile..the Narcs will still be empty till they die! It is unfortunate, but it is not your problem!!! Hugs

#21 Jan 21 - 12PM

Jackie

Added comment

I just wanted to also say that when I think about when I was going thru Cognitive Dissonance, I WAS FEELING SORRY FOR MYSELF AND BLAMING HIM AND ME! When I stopped feeling sorry for myself, and blaming him, and accepting that I allowed it! The Cognitive Dissonance disappeared and I started to see things clearly as they were! I had some work to do on ME! My self esteem was foremost! Had I had self esteem, I would have seen the red flags and not got involved!

#22 Jan 22 - 9AM (Reply to #2)

rainalaw

comment to your comment...

I found myself at this place also, Jackie. At first, I had to feel the pain of such a betrayal and I stayed there for about as long as I needed (I think :-) ). But I reached a point where I wanted to get what it was about me that put up with this type of treatment and not know that I deserved more. That I deserved to get my needs met. Why did I stay in denial? I wanted to get the life lesson because I sure don't want to do this "N thing" again. So, for me what I have found is that I need to take care of myself, forgive myself, even forgive the N, because that is what is good for me to grow as a peaceful person. If no other lesson I got from the N it was to see a way that I DO NOT WANT TO BE. Kind of like you have to know bad to know good. But the goal for me is to live somewhere in the grey...toward the light away from the dark N. On that journey :-) Rain

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