I still love him

53 posts / 0 new

#1 Feb 4 - 12PM

jen79

I still love him

I do, with every cell of my body.
I dont care which name you call it, call it trauma bond, call it unhealthy, call it daddy replacement.
I love him, he abused me, he was nice to me, he lied, he tried to be a friend, he manipulated me, he resented me, he feared me.

And I still love him, with so much passion.
Damn it.
Its so sad, sad, sad ,sad.
Sorry, just needed to write it out.

#2 Feb 6 - 9AM

jen79

My theory is

that we have a problem with the different kinds of bodies in humans. According to spiritual mysticicm, we have an emotional, a mental and a spiritual body. My theory is, that we are stuck with their emotional body, that is the psychic chord we feel, thats why we feel alot of nauseatic feelings. And at the same time we are seeing their spiritual body, or maybe even their higher self, somehow they have a hard time connecting to that. And I think, what we love is the spiritual body, or the higher self, like a ghost thats visiting us, and at the same time we have that strong bond to their emotional body. Maybe reiki, or some energy healing will help, I am ready to try everything, I guess it has to be done on a regular basis. MAybe two times a day.

#3 Feb 8 - 12PM (Reply to #48)

helldweller

jen and the spirtual body

Yes, yes, yes. That is how I always felt: that I was connected to his higher self, his moral and right self, his loving and upstanding and noble self. None of us realize our true selves on this earth, but some of us WAY less than others. It's hard for a compassionate, spiritual person to let go of the potential. Realizing that they don't hurt, don't feel, don't care is central. When I feel like going back, I just think to myself that it's better for me to wait until the other side. I keep telling myself that, someday, I will meet the real him after death and he will hug me and really look at me and talk with me and understand what he did and how much it hurt.

#4 Feb 10 - 10PM (Reply to #51)

jen79

Helldweller

I thought exactly the same. That I better wait to see him on the other side. I know there was a pre-life agreement. And I also know what I have seen, when I said I really see you, was his higher self, in fact thats what I really fell for, I never took his mask that seriously from the beginning, it was just a little disturbance to me. Maybe thats our dilemma, we all look right through the layers of false patterns and clusters of energy, we all see right away their true self, fall for it, and ignore the strong density of their weird mask. We will see each other on the other side, and then he will see, every word I ever said was true.

#5 Feb 11 - 6PM (Reply to #52)

Susan32

On the other side

I remember one of my friends telling me to not worry about the ex-Psych professor, that one day he'd find God. When I was "involved" with him, I DID worry about him. As he grew fatter, and his drinking became evident, I WAS concerned. Now I'm not worried. I don't have to see his daily drama... and the last time I ever heard about his personal life was a decade ago. I remember telling the ex-P that I was concerned about him hurting himself and hurting others. After the final D&D, I told him to get in touch with the REAL him, instead of simply playing a role. He'd talk about being one with divine Love, then act in unloving ways. When given unconditional love, he raged. I still pray for him... and it's EASIER now that he's not part of my life. I don't have to be around his negativity. On the other side, it wouldn't just be a matter of him seeing that I spoke truthfully... but that he'd have true remorse... and he'd also be TRULY happy. His "happiness" would no longer be fake, because he would be in God, and in God there is no falsehood.

#6 Feb 8 - 12PM (Reply to #49)

MandyM

That's an interesting way to

That's an interesting way to think of it - that we'll meet the true "them" on the other side. It's rather comforting, actually. I was talking about him in my therapy appointment this morning, and the only time I found myself choking up was when my therapist asked me how I feel about him now, knowing what he is and seeing all the red flags in hindsight. All I could think was that I felt sorry for him. Sorry in the sense that while I see all the signs of the narcissist, I also still see what I firmly believe were signs of the man he could have been and the emptiness inside him. I know there's nothing I can do for him, and nothing I can do about any of it - he's a lost cause. But I still feel love for THAT man. That's the hardest thing to let go of.

#7 Feb 8 - 12PM (Reply to #50)

onwithmylife

MandyM

I feel like you wrote your post just for me, because that is exactly how I,too, feel about my EXNarc and the man he could have been, but in that sense he probably would have been still married to wife #1 and i would never have met him! Instead he led a life of total devastation to all his wives, girlfriends me included, and children, how sad and has not a clue.I know there was a good man in side of him but destroyed by his upbringing in my opinion.It is the hardest thing to let go off, the man he COULD have been.I think of them as empty souls.

#8 Feb 6 - 9AM (Reply to #46)

gettinbetter

I know that there is

I know that there is definitely something to the psychic chord thing. I cant explain it but I know it. I feel as though he injected alot of his feeling in me via psychic chord. I do think however I have thrown the chord to him. Jen Im telling you when I was doing my chord cutting meditation regualarly I would get completely nauseated and would throw up. It was the strangest thing I have ever experienced. I think too when you have conceived a child together (which is my case) that the chord is even thicker and stronger. I believe once you have a child together born or unborn that you are eternally spiritually connected. Oh the irony of it all. He is adopted with no biological connection to anyone other than me (once you conceive a child together like it or not you were biologically connected). We lost our child but I still think that on a spiritual level we are still connected. So the irony of it all. He abandons the one person he is actually connected to on an eteranl level. I dont if Im explaining it all correctly but there is definitely something to it.

#9 Feb 6 - 9AM (Reply to #47)

jen79

Sick of it

This psychic chord cutting, I do this now twice a day. The first time, I bursted out into tears after. I defenetly felt a difference. I think its kind of an energy clearing, that needs to be done regulary.

#10 Feb 5 - 6PM

Briseis

I'm finally reading "The

I'm finally reading "The Betrayal Bond" which I can't recommend enough, especially regarding this subject. I'm reading that trauma actually causes stronger bonding between people than simple, enjoyable love and affection. A trauma bond can happen in the course of MOMENTS, and then last a life time. I can't help but think that it is a function of the betrayal type bond that keeps us so bonded in spite of the abuse and outrageous heartbreak. It's not something we can control. How trauma creates such strong bonds is built in to the system. It is "evolutionary", and the best example of that is soldiers in their foxholes, surviving a battle together. It strengthens BOTH soldier's drive to survive (the whole point). So here we are, trauma bonded to these absolute demonic jerks, and wondering WTF??? Well, it's just the way human minds work. We might always "love" the Narc, or feel some strong, unbreakable kind of "bond" with them. The idea is the know what to act on, and what NOT to act on. This is one of those "nots" :)

#11 Feb 8 - 12PM (Reply to #44)

neverlookback

TRAUMA BONDING

We might always "love" the Narc, or feel some strong, unbreakable kind of "bond" with them. I will always love what he appeared to me as, even if it was not real I LOVED IT and HIM and what he was to me. I know I will carry that in my heart for a long time. That image of what he once was - and yet I know now he was mirroring and it was actually myself that I was falling in love with, can you really make sense of all this psychology, the more we understand it though the more we can put it in place and move on. Through all his pathology he truly and deeply had me love in a way I have never loved before, and I would be lying if I said today I can really ever forget that. Yes Yes I had a deep deep trauma bond with a psychopath, most who fall victim do. Today at the drop of a hat I could burst into heavy crying if something provokes me to remember what he pretended to be for me, this is by far the most gut wrenching part to heal from and learn to live with.

#12 Feb 5 - 6PM (Reply to #40)

gettinbetter

Briseis

This is the absolute core of my issues with the NARC and there wasnt just one moment where it was created there were many and this horrible bond has lay dormant in me all these years. It totally explains why it has been so much worse this time around and I only saw him 3 times last year. If Im not mistaken it deepens the longer it stays in place and/or the more you engage with your abuser correct? I am at some point going to buy this book but are there any easy steps that we would all benefit from that we can put into practice immediately aside from the obvious no contact?

#13 Feb 5 - 7PM (Reply to #41)

Briseis

I really wish you could get

I really wish you could get the book, SOI. I know it just wouldn't do to have it laying around your house . . . but if there's ANY way you could, disguise it with a different book jacket or something. The book itself is full of exercises and self inventory/relationship inventory tools. I don't think these fall under the category of "easy steps" lol but I know what you mean by "easy". Simple and cut and dried, you probably mean. And yes, I'd call this book VERY easy to get. I'm reading and of course thinking of myself, but since I know your sitch so well, SOI, I sure find myself thinking a lot of YOU when I read it too. Understanding what the trauma bond IS takes a lot of the wind out of the sails. Instead of misinterpreting the longing and obsession as "love", you see it for what it really is. A particular kind of human bond that backfired on you. So even after the very heartfelt posts on this board about loving the abuser, I ride the fence on whether or not I'd call what I feel for my exNarc "love", or if it was ever love at all, beyond the first couple of years. It would be intrusive and unempathetic of me to insist that everyone is deluded, that they really DON'T love their Narc, it's all trauma bond. So I won't, and I promise I don't even secretly believe it. I don't understand how you could continue to love someone who has so brutally abused you. I don't. We are all unique individuals, for all the similarities. How to break the trauma bond, when you really just want it GONE?? I accomplished this, but I'm not sure exactly how. Maybe it's because I'm analytical? And I naturally hate people who treat me like shit :D ?? LOL, I just speak of myself here :) If looking full on at the devastation to your heart and soul does NOT inspire you to loathe your Narc rather than still love him, I don't know what to say. Only that I believe you when you say it (not just you SOI, but everyone here). For you SOI, I'd suggest you take a long hard look at what you have to lose, and seriously imagine it. From your husband discovering this relationship (the recent one), to his reaction, to how that would affect your life. Amazingly badly. You came SO CLOSE to losing it all because of that slimy sonofabitch and your trauma bond to him. It wasn't just the Narc hurting and betraying YOU. I'm talking what knowledge of this would have done to your husband and your daughter and your extended family. Your Narc, and your trauma bond TO him, could have destroyed your entire life and the lives of many other people too. And then, for you, I'd go full tilt into my marriage and family, and thank God every day for them and do everything in my power to prevent opportunity to THINK about him. Some things in life are so bad that it is poisonous to even indulge in thoughts about them. UNLESS your "thoughts" are aimed at helping others going through the same experience. I've found that, too, to be very healing. It changes the immediate pain of what happened to me into a devotion to helping others who suffer. It gets me out of my blasted self, from being so focused on what happened to MEEEEE, and HIIIMMMMMM. I hope that makes sense. There comes a time when it's just plain old indulging yourself in "thoughts of him", going over and over what he did. When you start to wonder if that's what you are doing, then you are probably right, it's time to move to the next level.

#14 Feb 6 - 9AM (Reply to #43)

Happy1

The Betrayal Bond

I have it on my iphone and it's really helpful to read. It has opened my eyes and made me aware of a lot of what I felt. I am doing a lot better. It's a must read for anyone that feels this way.

#15 Feb 5 - 9PM (Reply to #42)

gettinbetter

Oh how I wish I could help

Oh how I wish I could help someone else. I try when I can but I would say I can barely help myself. All I know is it is a terrible addiction for me and I can remember when I was a young woman my mother shaking me one night saying Dear God what has this boy done to you? What is this hold he has over you? I feel like I have to get to the root of almost dissect so I can understand it that it will come back again. This man has been showing up in my life since age 17. I'm sure he is gone now for several years but I'm almost positive he's not gone forever. If I don't dismantle this bond its only a matter of time before he shows up again and ill be right back where I started I do find myself indulging in thoughts of him what can I say other than I'm a crack head. I also don't think it was very good timing on my part to get off of my zoloft. I just got my prescription refilled today and after only one dose I could feel my mood improving I'm only on 50 mg a couple of years ago I was on 100mg. It will be interesting to see how I feel in a couple of weeks. All I know is that every few weeks I spend a week where it seems I am vomiting up pain and then I do ok and so on. I did ok tonite watched a movie with the family and lookd over at them in gratitude. Oh geez I'm just ramblin on..... maybe one day I will be able to throw someone else a life preserver. I sure hope so

#16 Feb 5 - 5PM

broken23

this is such a great thread

this is such a great thread filled with so much insight and honesty. i dont know about others, but i also feel like i still love him no matter what anyone says. i can even distinguish the other feelings. sometimes im lonely, and i miss someone. sometimes its specific, where i really miss him, i want to let him know something in particular share a joy or sorrow. If there was a cure for NPD, i would give my arm to have him be cured. But with that said i know there is no cure. I guess to love someone and have a life with them are different. The way i see it my love was genuine so how could it just vanish. In time we will all heal and hopefully forget as much as humanly possible. That is my wish for all of us, especially the ones that suffer like this. Hugs.

#17 Feb 5 - 1PM

onwithmylife

JEN79

You probably said what we all feel from time to time. I was just back from visiting EX narcs first wife and second husband, I am good friends with to say goodbye,but will keep in touch, as I am moving out of state, driving by the town he use to live still hurts and haunts me, such a deep sadness in my heart after 2 years out, the move to new scenery will be good for me I feel, I need a new beginning for my soul.We loved these men and can love again, they can NOT..Goldies post says it all..........

#18 Feb 5 - 8AM

finallyletgo

goldie that was a beautiful

goldie that was a beautiful post and helps me as i heal from this trauma and accpet things for what they are. Jen i feel exactly the way you do but i agree with Goldie its our capacity to love is what the rel was about..they just took it for their advantage and mirrored us.. its ok to admit that you love him..i still do of mine even though he thinks i hate him i cant lie to myself...this will pass..and its good that you are feeling all the feelings in teh grieving process

#19 Feb 4 - 5PM

Goldie

Great subject

Hi Jen, I love what you wrote because honestly for me, this is when my true healing began. Love comes from within, it actually has little to do with the other person and how they feel. A loving relationship needs two loving participates to grow, survive, and evolve. So many people wanted me to hate my X and I could not and still do not. Some people need to feel that to break the tie, the unhealthy bond, for me, it did not play out that way. I loved him with all of my heart and I still do love him. I never stopped loving him. This was the most difficult lesson of all for me to learn in all of this. I learned that my love for him was about me; not him. My love was my capacity to give, feel, and it is not my fault that he was unable to return this love. He is not in love with me or able to be loving with a woman and this is o.k. for me to accept today. I learned that it is o.k. to love someone and grow up enough within myself to realize that even though my feeling did not change, that in order to thrive and survive, I had to be the one to say good by to that love and let it go. I had to care enough about my life and future to say NO to spending my life or anymore time with a severely disordered person. I had to force myself to let go and go N/C even when he was trying to suck me back in; regardless to how I felt. I think sometimes that we think we have to wait until we hate them or feel nothing to get out and this is not always the case. We can get out even though we love them and still want them with ever ounce of our mind, body, and soul. This was the hardest thing I ever had to do and I have no regrets. I know that it was the right decision and honestly, I never want him to know how I felt, and still feel sometimes because, I know today that he would use that love as a sign of weakness and he would use it as a tool to try to control and manipulate me. So it is my little secret. One of the last times we spoke before he went to jail, I told him that I did not love him anymore and he needed to find someone else and I was sure that he would and he would be fine, but that it was not going to be me. Yes, it was a white lie, however, he had been lying to me for so long that I had to say something to break it for me. Will I ever love again? Of course I will because I am a loving being and I love to love. The funny thing is for me, once I accepted that I loved him and also accepted that I could not be with him anymore because of his vast sickness, the obsession began to break, because I was in control now, I had made a decission based on the facts and I felt like I was getting my power back and becoming a grown up woman and not a little girl crying and pinning over what never could be. Admitting and accepting my feelings was huge for me. He got out of jail a few days ago and I was terrified he would come back and see my love for him in my eyes and I would have to disengage all over again and I told people what was up and they were supportive and together we have gone to great lengths to assure that I will not have to deal with him face to face for any reason. Especially for the first few weeks while my psyche gets adjusted to the fact that he is out now and I may very well run into him one day. I know as I adjust to this I will become even stronger and will be o.k. if I do ever see him because I made a decision to choose my life over his dysfunction and I have no intentions of going back on this agreement with myself no matter what. Once we take back our power over our own lives, yes these things still hurt and it sucks not getting the one you want, however, I have no doubt that there is someone much better in store for me when the time is right. I don't believe that we were put on this earth to suffer as we have with these Np's who are incapable of love. Thanks for sharing Jen, I hear you and time is the great healer for all of us, enough time away from them, learning to love ourselves fully, and enjoying life and love again some day. Goldie

#20 Feb 8 - 3AM (Reply to #35)

daisyme

beautiful post, goldie...

like many of you here, i feel the same way. i still love my exN and feel that i always will. i do absolutely hate the horrendous things that he's done, but deep down, my feelings haven't changed for him. it seems that what is crucial is finding a way to make peace with these feelings in a healthy way (and definitely without him!).

#21 Feb 5 - 11AM (Reply to #34)

gettinbetter

For me I think I will love

For me I think I will love fake guy forever but I cant be with him because really he only makes a guest appearance every now and then. When he left the first time it took awhile but I did find love again and he was far from my thoughts. I know it just takes time and the realization that you cannot be with them atleast not if you want to live. They are radioactive and they will slowly poision you if you stay long enough. Its just a fact a sad one but a fact.

#22 Feb 5 - 1AM (Reply to #33)

Journey

Goldie

I appreciate your post, well said. Thank you Journey on...

Journey on...

#23 Feb 4 - 5PM (Reply to #23)

jen79

goldie

The funny thing is for me, once I accepted that I loved him and also accepted that I could not be with him anymore because of his vast sickness, the obsession began to break, because I was in control now, I had made a decission based on the facts and I felt like I was getting my power back and becoming a grown up woman and not a little girl crying and pinning over what never could be. Yes thats it. I thought about the same thing. What is it that I have to give up, not the pain, the advantages. Being a victim, being irresponsable and having a great excuse, and yes the passion and the dream. Thats what I have to give up and let go. And still I love him, but I feel its enough now. I have two options, not ever seeing him again and crave for him, or not ever seeing him again and get better. Since he didnt want to see me again anyway. Thats how I feel now. And somehow I feel a little bit better. I hope it will last.

#24 Feb 4 - 7PM (Reply to #31)

Goldie

Jen

Being a victim, being irresponsable and having a great excuse, and yes the passion and the dream. Yes, God forbid I stop falling for these "jokers" and fall for a guy of equal yoking who I might actually be happy with, hmmmmmm? Having a great excuse, I can buy that. Yes, indeed. Good stuff Jen, as usual. Now we are getting somewhere!!! Goldie

#25 Feb 5 - 12AM (Reply to #32)

blueeyes

We all hit this point

Where we love but realize we can't. I agree with Goldie, great subject. Sad subject too. Thanks for your post Jen. Goldie, thanks for your insight again :)

#26 Feb 4 - 6PM (Reply to #24)

Susan32

Sometimes you love by leaving

A Buddhist teacher told me that I did the compassionate thing by leaving. Yes, I had left without saying goodbye, there was no proper closure... because there couldn't be. Going NC is very compassionate, it stops the enabling. I realized I would be happier on my own- carving my own way- than miserably married to him. I once prophetically told the ex-Psych professor that I preferred being happy on my own than to be unhappily tied to him. His words "You don't want to be stuck with me for the rest of your life" rang true as well. If I had spent the past decade married to him&having his kids, I'd be a wreck. It would be a lot of time lost. I would've been like poor Sofia Tolstoy, who wept and pined for her own husband, the father of many children, till the end, and who even went to his grave apologizing daily. No way to live! Not a way to live at all. The final D&D was a blessing in disguise.

#27 Feb 4 - 10PM (Reply to #25)

apple

Susan...

Didn't Sofia Tolstoy kill herself by stepping in front of a train? I'm trying to remember.

#28 Feb 4 - 11PM (Reply to #26)

Susan32

Sofia Tolstoy

It was the fictional Anna Karenina who killed herself by throwing herself in front of a train. Leo Tolstoy had a sick, morbid fascination with the naked, mutilated corpse of a woman who had had an extra-marital affair&killed herself that way (thus inspiring the novel) However, Sofia Tolstoy attempted suicide several times. She felt suicidal during her honeymoon after Leo forced himself on her on the carriage ride home after the ceremony. She tried killing herself by jumping into a frozen lake. After sex, she'd be weeping&threatening suicide. She felt THAT degraded. A NORMAL man would be horrified if a woman felt suicidal after sex. He'd comfort her. Leo got a kick out of it. He'd force her into sex, blame her for it, she'd feel degraded- then he'd comfort her (the whole push-pull cycle) Sofia Tolstoy outlived her famous husband by several years, since she was 15 years his junior. I suggest "The Last Station" movie starring Christopher Plummer as Leo and Helen Mirren as Sofia. The filmmakers tried to portray them as a loving, quarreling old married couple- when in fact Leo had NPD big time. They don't show his emotional abuse, or how he threatened to kill Sofia when she was in pain after giving birth to their first child, or how he emotionally abused her because she couldn't breast feed.

#29 Feb 5 - 10PM (Reply to #27)

apple

Susan...

Thanks for explaining that to me. I read that novel in lit class years ago but had forgotten. How sad for Sofia having to live like that. I will see if I can find that movie since now you have me interested. =)

#30 Feb 5 - 10PM (Reply to #28)

Susan32

Tchaikovsky's "Mazeppa"

Tchaikovsky was an admirer of Tolstoy. But there came a point when Tchaikovsky, he of "Swan Lake" (thanks Natalie Portman&Darren Aronofsky for "Black Swan") and "Nutcracker", made a point of going NC on Leo Tolstoy. When Tchaikovsky took his walks, he made a point of avoiding Tolstoy COMPLETELY! The composer whose "Nutcracker" brightens the faces of the young at Christmastime practiced NC. Some have argued that "Mazeppa", Tchaikovsky's grimmest opera and one of his least performed works, was inspired by the Tolstoys' marriage. It was based on Ivan Mazeppa, a Ukrainian hetman who fought Peter the Great. (Tolstoy had fought in the Battle of Sebastopol-in the Ukraine-during the Crimean War) There are some eerie parallels. 1)The heroine, Maria, admires Mazeppa before she marries him. Sofia had admired Leo Tolstoy's writing before she married him. She had memorized his "Childhood" and "Youth." 2)In the opera, Mazeppa and Maria's father are childhood buddies. Tolstoy was a childhood friend of Sofia's father. 3)Mazeppa forces Maria to choose between her family&him. When Sofia was weeping during her honeymoon, Leo told Sofia "if you miss your family that much, you don't love me that much." 4)Mazeppa is excommunicated for marrying his goddaughter Maria. Leo Tolstoy was excommunicated by the Russian Orthodox Church;last year, some of his fans tried to have the Russian Orthodox Church revoke his excommunication in the centennial of his death. It didn't succeed. The Russian Orthodox has made the same refusal in terms of Mazeppa. The ending is prophetic when Mazeppa abandons his now maddened wife. Leo abandoned his wife&family (he had done so several times) The ex-Psych professor was so paranoid about the possibility of me reading his beloved "War and Peace" that my senior class was assigned "Anna Karenina" instead. It caused great division among the seniors. "Anna Karenina" spoke to me, because Anna's older husband, Alexei, who's old enough to be her father, is an emotionally remote cerebral Narc. During the final D&D, I'd be telling the ex-P that he was like the cold, proper Alexei. "Anna Karenina" was more useful than "War and Peace." Talk about major backfiring when Ns/Ps try to have control!

#31 Feb 7 - 9PM (Reply to #29)

apple

Susan...

I just got The Last Station in the mail from Netflix today!!!! That is sooo weird. I had it in my queue the entire time!!!!!!!!

1
2
next
last

Path Forward Buy Now Reviews
All About Her Buy Now Reviews
All About Him Buy Now Reviews