Charlie Sheen

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#1 Mar 2 - 6AM
Kath1234
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Charlie Sheen

I'm not sure how many of you are following the Charlie Sheen saga, but I'm curious if any of you recognize similarities between Sheen and the Narc in your life??

After watching a tv interview with Sheen last night, I was amazed how he reminded me of my ex Narc with his grandiose statements!

It's one thing to read about narcissism, but it's another thing to witness ANOTHER individual with the exact same personality disorder. Scary actually !

Mar 7 - 6AM
IncognitoBurrito
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Hey!

Thanks for the Charlie Sheen dream last night, people!!! Ha! What kind of kinky stuff is going on in MY brain? Oh no... :o)
Mar 2 - 2PM
Disillusionedx2
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Under the influence....

Either he was under the influence of something or just high on his ego/life wired for sound, I don't think he realize what he's doing/saying he's self-destructing, bi~polar maybe, though no one has ever witnessed his lows? He look/sound horrible. I don't know, he will not see any mental health professional I'm sure Dr. Phil tried, he's a hand full!

stay~strong

Mar 2 - 1PM
GhostBuster
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Interesting link

CS and link to NPD from a clinical psychologist's perspective. I think this is dead-on. http://www.afterpsychotherapy.com/charlie-sheen-narcissism/ I've heard some say it can't be NPD because he's self destructing and narcissists care too much about their image. I think that's true most of the time...until they come undone from marriage ending, losing a job, or some other event that causes them look bad. I think it's called dysphoria?
Mar 4 - 3PM (Reply to #15)
Lisa E. Scott
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Charlie Sheen

Ghostbuster - good to see you! Been too long. Great post and thanks for the link. Susan - Great point - "deficiency of NS leads to a major breakdown with Ns/Ps" I think Charlie Sheen is unraveling because he is in such shock that the network has pulled the plug on him. Since he's not on tv once a week getting Narcissistic Supply with his sitcom, he's finding another way to get it by doing radio and talk shows. I think he is a text book narcissist who is having a serious breakdown because he is in such disbelief that the network is saying they don't need him now. This is a HUGE narcissistic injury to him. As Ghostbuster said, when this kind of thing happens, they lose all control and forget about projecting the perfect image. ABC - I wanted to see the David Arquette interview. I bet that was very telling. Definitely a lot of narcissists in hollywood, that's for sure.
Mar 4 - 6PM (Reply to #16)
M
M's picture

agreed

I think Charlie's finally being exposed & not tolerated. His whole NS world is falling apart--and the porn star "goddesses" he lives with are not providing enough NS. I see my xhN following that same path... just a matter of time.
Mar 4 - 6PM (Reply to #17)
IncognitoBurrito
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4,3,2,1....

I'm waiting until both goddesses turn on him, and go for what money he has left, that isn't going to one of umpteen children. Oops...that was mean!
Mar 4 - 7PM (Reply to #18)
Disillusionedx2
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for sure....but

Some supply sources are fiercely loyal to these guys for whatever reason, probably their own insecurities, they are so young and impressionable but after the $ run out, they likely will also....

stay~strong

Mar 2 - 1PM (Reply to #14)
Susan32
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Dysphoria

Sam Vaknin speaks of how the deficiency of NS leads to a major breakdown with Ns/Ps. During the final D&D, the ex-Psych professor was berating me to tears publicly... I told him it was bad for HIS image (yes, I appealed to his vanity instead of a sense of decency) He thought it made him look powerful&sane, and make me look crazy,hysterical, wildly enamored... when in fact it made him look bad in the eyes of his colleagues. He'd be berating me for "inappropriate behavior" but his colleagues were on my side, not his. During the final D&D, the ex-P was drinking heavily. There were rumors of his alcoholism... that he validated when he conducted an off-campus class that consisted of drinking wine. He'd reminisce about how students would bring wine to class when he went to the University of Virginia (turns out that yes, this is a custom there) His long-distance girlfriend in LA was in the process of moving in with him during the final D&D. He had a total meltdown. When he physically abandoned his girlfriend in front of his colleagues and went running down the stairs, I don't think that looked good either. In fact, he didn't even bother introducing her to his colleagues.
Mar 2 - 10AM
ABC0311
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Does not

remind me of my future XN. Mine is not as (obviously) conceited. He plays the martyr and the victim. He *appears* as a nice guy on the outside world. Personally, I saw David Arquette's interview on Oprah... HE reminded me of mine. I suspect he is one. He said lots of things that reminded me of mine... Just sayin'.
Mar 2 - 9AM
IncognitoBurrito
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So bad!

Good lord, he's hot! I mean, a hot mess, but still. Cocky, brazen, a little bravado never hurts. Confident, an answer for everything, sarcasm in spades. Alright, so he may be text book, narc, or seemingly so, as a result of addiction. He sounds terrible, like he's been drinking and smoking for ages. He seemed on the defensive the whole time. Like everything was trivial, and I can understand that. Joking around and laughter is sometimes used to divert and/or evade uncomfortable situations or intrusive questions. It can seem inappropriate, even if that's not what's intended. He says one thing, the interviewer takes said, random, meaningless statement and tries to apply it to the real world. Then segues into his personal life repeatedly. Yet the very reason he seems to make light of the whole situation, is because he knows everything he says is going to be taken 100% seriously, in the court of public opinion. This is a person who's stopped giving a s**t about what people think of him. Self-protection and the need for some things to remain private, sacred, are perfectly normal things to want. These things aren't afforded to those living their lives under a microscope. Yet the way the camera picks this up, and the way this comes off is "erratic." It's a no win situation. Or, I have enabling habits! Oh, Charlie.
Mar 4 - 2PM (Reply to #5)
Susan32
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Joking and laughter

"Joking around&laughter used to divert and/or evade uncomfortable situations or intrusive questions. It can seem inappropriate, even if that's not what's intended"- Wow. Reading that brought back memories. I used to be giggly, smiling, and joking around in the ex-Psych professor's presence. I'd practically go skipping to him, smiling. He'd accuse me of laughing at him, not taking him seriously, snap at me "be more serious!" and yes, that my natural cheerfulness was because I was uncomfortable around him. He was downright *paranoid* about being laughed at. He was afraid that I was laughing at him... yet he had no problems mocking my pain, and laughing at me when I was weeping. When he thought I was laughing at him (even if I weren't), he'd find a way to run away. He'd accuse me of being evasive. Seeing me happy&cheerful with his long-distance girlfriend led to the ex-P dashing down the stairs, physically abandoning her. He'd accuse me of being nervous in his presence... well, I DID feel nervous around him. He acted in ways that made me nervous.
Mar 4 - 4PM (Reply to #6)
IncognitoBurrito
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Susan

"He acted in ways that made me nervous." ...and rightfully so! I've read bits and pieces of your story w/the Prof, and it's left me raising an eyebrow more than once. It'd be interesting to see how his babies turn out, but that's already a thread. :o) What professor takes it upon themselves to tell a student how to behave? I assume you already have a father, for that! Especially, by college, it's really nobody's business what you do, whether you pass or fail. It's on your shoulders. He had no right to tell you what to wear, nor how to act. Nobody does, but your parents, typically. Of course, it tanned his hide, to see you mingle w/his girlfriend. He was probably hoping she'd make you jealous. Kind of backfired, when his prop got preggers, hm? Sick. Anyway, if I remember correctly, you said it's been 11 years since? Have you been able to talk to someone about this, in that time? Do you feel better about it?
Mar 4 - 5PM (Reply to #11)
Susan32
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The timeline

When the ex-Psych prof got his girlfriend pregnant, it was literally around the time I left. I didn't know about the pregnancy till... around 9/11,and the twins were between 4-6 months old. He has family in Massachusetts. I never saw his girlfriend pregnant... I found out waaay after the fact. "It tanned to see you mingle with his girlfriend"-Believe me, I taunted him about it afterwards, telling him how it turns some guys on when they see cat fights. I helpfully informed him about the mud wrestling pit at the upper dorms. I mocked him, telling him he had WANTED a fight... and it tickled me pink to not give it to him. The ex-P hated children... he found babies disgusting, and said that like Leo Tolstoy, he'd avoid the nursery. It was a motif all 4 years. He said that if I were pregnant with his kids, he'd be disappointed&fed up with me (because Prince Andrei in "War and Peace" is fed up with his wife on account of her pregnancy) So I did for the kids. I spared them. His sperm were judged undeserving. He found the whole process of pregnancy disgusting. MOST Ns/Ps presented here are Mommy-enmeshed. The ex-P was Daddy-enmeshed. There's a scene in "War and Peace" in which Prince Andrei affectionately kisses his father in front of his pregnant wife, then kisses his expectant wife's hand as if she were a stranger... the ex-P would say that he'd do the same to me. I think he didn't outgrow the stage when little boys have made their break from Mom and are bonding with Dad. He wanted a woman who would be like his father... his girlfriend (later wife) wrote a dry scientific paper about the restoration of dolls (she's a curator)... and his father is a scientist. A run of the mill N/P wants a woman like Mom... mine wanted a woman like Dad. That's even harder to do.
Mar 4 - 4PM (Reply to #7)
Susan32
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I have a father!

Teachers are supposed to act in loco parentis (in the place of the person), but he acted more like a loco parent. "It'd be interesting to see how his babies turn out"-His parents moved in with him to raise them... I found THAT out a year after the D&D. A boy and a girl, so a friend&I nicknamed them Luke&Leia (of course, geek that I am, I hummed the Imperial theme) My friend said that having his parents raise them was *PROOF* of his selfishness, that just as he hadn't made sacrifices for me, he hadn't made sacrifices for his girlfriend (whom he married after she gave birth) The ex-P bragged about driving his poor father crazy... so I hope his father is raising them right. I made a snide remark at the time that his parents were raising his kids... AND him. It reminded me of elementary school when teachers send the bully&the victim back home to their parents, I was living with my parents at the time... except God was doing it. God was acting like the Principal in the Sky. Amen. "He was probably hoping she'd make you jealous"-I was more angry that he hadn't told me about the girlfriend than the fact that he had one. When I dated (he'd complain to his students about it on class time, then NOT address it with me), I was OPEN about it. It was NOT a secret. Even my parents knew. What's weird is that when I met the girlfriend... it was like looking at my reflection. She was a nerdy brunette, like me. (She resembled the ex-P EVEN MORE than me, she was very butch, had a crew cut like him) I think I wanted OUT so much that I wasn't envious... and the fact that I hadn't gotten physically/sexually/romantically involved with the ex-P complicated it. If I had had sex with him, there would've been jealousy. If he&I had wined&dined off-campus, I would've been a raving maniac. I think the ex-P wanted to string the both of us along, like Leo Tolstoy did to Sofia (his wife)&her sisters, as well as a serf with whom he had fathered a son, or the character of Prince Nicolai Rostov in "War and Peace" who keeps the rivalry alive between his wife Marya&his childhood sweetheart the poor orphan Sonya even after he's married. Nicolai strings both along, even after he's a married husband&Sonya sticks around as a housekeeper/nanny. I think the ex-P wanted me around to be a rival&that he'd settle with the one he impregnated. But I went NC on him in town... then I left town without telling anyone (Agnes Murphy is RIGHT, so right on that advice!!) He impregnated her around the time I left... it's as if he sensed I was leaving, and he had always said that the only way he could keep a woman is if he got her pregnant. He'd brag that he'd impregnate me immediately if I married him. Yes, it's been 11 years since the final D&D. He hasn't contacted me... and if his father is the reason&his father understands... I send him my positive vibes. I've broken NC occasionally, but I think his father knows. His father put him on a philosophical forum with him about consequences/karma/causality, *SOMETHING I WOULD'VE DONE* "Have you been able to talk to someone about this"-It's been difficult, since it was teacher/student, not as if he were my ex-husband,or an ex-boyfriend, or if he were owing me child support. I've found a therapist. He's into forgiveness, pretty progressive/politically liberal... and for all his spirituality... he defines the ex-P as *EVIL.* It's been purifying. I've brought up some painful stuff, and when he talked about addiction to drama/enabling... a light clicked on. "Do you feel better about it"-I talked about it with a Buddhist who had been teaching about compassion. Compassion does NOT condone abuse. He said my decision to leave without even saying bye was the MOST compassionate thing to do. It was like taking alcohol away from a drinker. I had done the tough love. What was triggering were recent events at my college. There was a former classmate, and when she&I were in freshman lab, the ex-P triangulated, and she believed all his lies. We were nearly friends. During the D&D 11 years ago, I dreamt that she&I reconciled&forgave each other at a college reunion. In '09, this classmate, who stayed behind to be a professor (and who was closer to the ex-P than me)... died under unspecified causes. She was only 40. She died in her sleep. It wasn't homicide or murder... but ZERO closure. I instinctively thought "That could've been me" and "I hope it was natural causes." No cause of death has ever been given. Her death... brought me to this forum. Literally. To make peace with the past. I realized I couldn't save her. That it wasn't my fault. Last year, a tech expert who was hired the year I graduated (he was an acquaintance of mine,I saw him at the computer lab), killed himself after he got in trouble with the law for stealing prescription drugs from pharmacies. Not too long ago, a girl was expelled for anorexia&depression... and that nearly happened to me because of the ex-P my freshman year. My mother is now researching NPD because of my Narc grandmother. I'm able to provide validation, understand why my Narc grandmother will do outrageous things like go out into the rain without suitable clothes, make a spectacle of herself. My mother thinks I should write about NPD... I am a published writer. The ex-P discouraged me from journalism&writing about religion/spirituality... I've been doing BOTH for the past 8 years. Getting my own closure is a *PROCESS.* As Michael Franti sings "I know I'm not alone." The stories here are inspiring. The women here are inspiring. This is a safe haven. Reading parts of "War and Peace" have helped me understand NPD&come to terms with my experience (how ironic, the ex-P lectured on it in '09) "War and Peace" has NPD embodied in fictional characters, so there's a distance... but it is the distance that brings understanding. I feel like Ariadne emerging from the depths of the Labyrinth into the sunlight (she was granddaughter of the sun god Helios) My therapist said he's seen healing in me, healing I haven't recognized. In some ways, there are scars, there's scar tissue.. but I am more healed than I was a decade ago. Healing is a process. "Everything is illuminated in the light of the past"-Jonathan Safran Foer
Mar 4 - 7PM (Reply to #8)
Lisa E. Scott
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Susan

I would definitely agree that his parents moving in to help raise the children is PROOF of his selfishness. I'm so glad they took the kids away from Charlie Sheen and his Goddesses. Those young ladies will only stick around until the money dries up.
Mar 7 - 4PM (Reply to #10)
Susan32
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Having other people raise their kids...

I once had a morbidly obese Narc coworker who complained constantly about paying child support... he did everything to dodge it, but he got caught. He was mad about getting caught&having cash taken out of his paycheck... when it was the fact that he had had sex with his ex-wife, making her pregnant was *his* responsibility. It's not as if his ex-wife had a virgin birth. The Narc coworker couldn't stand taking responsibility for his kids, even if it was solely monetary. And here's something from the recent issue of the New Yorker about the modern painter Amodeo Modigliani http://www.newyorker.com- "They (Modigliani and his wife Jeanne Hebuterne) farmed the baby out to a friend;Modigliani's needs were law. Hebuterne tended to him with 'a terrible patience.' Meanwhile, she was pregnant again, this time without succor from anyone in her family." After Modigliani died from tuberculosis, the pregnant Jeanne killed herself the day before his funeral. Modigliani was a Narc. He was known to cause chaos at bistros&cafes, then sit in total silence with Jeanne. She was an enamored art student, young enough to be his daughter. He was also alcoholic, even when he was dying from a nasty combination of tuberculosis&meningitis.
Mar 5 - 2PM (Reply to #9)
Susan32
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You might find this eerie...

My mother&I predicted that the ex-Psych prof would father twins, and that his parents would raise them---a good FIVE YEARS before it happened. Sometimes I hate being right. Because it wasn't a cheery, happy prediction. The ex-P's parents moved all the way from the Bay State to the Southwest to raise his kids. His father sacrificed his professorship&research (you might've heard him discuss crying&the biological function of tears on NPR).. a respected man in the field. With most of the ex-P's colleagues,since A LOT of them were older parents,this is what commonly happened- 1)Hiring a student as a nanny/babysitter 2)Mother goes on "mommy track" or is housewife already 3)Putting kids in daycare Having the parents move in was an unusual move (not in a good way) My parents said that if my sis had had twins, they would move close by to help--but NOT move in to raise them(!!) As for Charlie Sheen losing his kids... thank goodness. There IS karma after all. Those kids need a stable, sane upbringing, a sane father... something he can't provide.
Mar 2 - 8AM
Allergic2Narc
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CS

there is definitely something wrong with CS. I'm not quite sure if it's narcissism because he admits he's a drug user and a porn officiado and doesnt' care what people think. None of the narcs in my life admit to anything and image to them is everything. So, is CS a narc? I don't know but he is mental that's for sure.
Mar 2 - 6AM
spinning
spinning's picture

Unfortunately, it's hard not to

follow the CS saga. Ugh! Though I didn't see the interview I saw enough snippets, etc. over the past two days to see the true nature of the beast. And yes, there are many, many similarities... ...I do not want to be specific but the disordered one I was involved with also referred to the blood of a certain animal in his veins; thought he was imbued with super powers, etc. PUKE. SCARY. Those super powers turned out to be the incredible ability to delude himself. It's embarassing to even admit I was with such a nutjob! I cannot wait until I'm clear of this one day. Lately, I find myself stuck once again on fantasies of revenge... sincerely (still trying hard to stop) spinning

spinning

Mar 2 - 10AM (Reply to #2)
IncognitoBurrito
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Yeah...

When he said he has "tiger blood and Adonis DNA" I had to roll my eyes. That really was overboard. He so heavily uses that dead pan humor in the interview, that it's hard to know when he's joking, and when he believes what he's saying. You have to know someone to decipher that, when they're being "cute."