Alpha females

Great point! Mine got a free trip to Europe for one year and I paid for his graduate school. I went on to do allright and he was fired from a lot of jobs. Narcs would be attracted to alpha females as they are users and always have a personal agenda. At the time I was chosen I didn't know anything about narcissim or their behavior pattern.

Just thinking more about alpha females. I wonder if deep down they like the independent types because they know they won't have to take care of us, and that when they dump us they can blame us. Mine always liked to say that I was too busy for him, too independent, etc, even though that was never, ever the case. It's like he WANTED to believe that--like that was how he intended the story to play out: that I would abandon him because I was too busy and independent. When I wouldn't play along he got pissed. Strangely, his brother's girlfriend once told me that her secret to "happiness" with hers was that she didn't do anything for him; she said that from what she knew that's how their mother was, and that the sons have no respect for women who take care of them. Mine didn't seem to know what he wanted me to do. If I made him lunch, he loved it. If I didn't make it one day because he was a jerk, it was "proof" that I didn't love him. When I started seeing someone else after he left my daughters and me home and went to Christmas dinner without us, after a year of similarly debasing treatment, my seeing someone else was "proof" that I didn't love him. Nothing I did in response to his outrageous behavior was a response; it was, in his eyes, "proof" that I didn't love him.

Just read the topic on Alpha Females for the first time. Wow, yes. I've written seven books, I have three degrees, I was a legal assistant for years and worked for many of his colleagues who regarded me as an equal and amazing at legal work. I sing, am a whiz at decorating and gardening--people say I leave beauty behind everywhere I go, ha ha, no kidding. When I walk my girls to school at 7:30 a.m. I'm in a dress, heels and makeup, though I work at home, and after school I'm out rollerskating and playing tag with the other kids--before whippping up a gourmet dinner every night, of course. I was very thrown off by the N for a long time, because it seemed obvious that he "picked" me because I was so capable, accomplished, etc., but then I started to realize that he didn't think I was so great--when he'd go for five hour lunches with other females I couldn't meet, or lie about having to work because he was going to a party and didn't want me along. Toward the end, he got really drunk one night and called my family and me "trash." It's really wild. The kicker is that he has nothing to show for himself. His judgship was gotten for him by his dad, who also helped him get through law school. He was left millions by his parents, and just mooches off all of his friends. His house is huge and empty. He does nothing, has no interests, and can't have a conversation with anyone he doesn't know. Sometimes I felt he was punishing me for being what I am. In the end, he took a lot of my qualities away from me. I ended up in sweatpants, twenty pounds overweight, pale, watching t.v. in a cluttered, dirty house. That's when then dump you and essentially say, "Why would you think I would want YOU? You're a mess!"

i sometimes i feel like an alpha female, and that's why i would get these weird effed up feelings when N would always go out of his way to schedule luncheon dates with his other "friends" who were women. i'm too territorial for that bs, esp when he wouldn't tell me about it or invite me, going on about what a deep connection he has with all of them... getting his supply. an alpha female cannot handle that, imo. i was independent, working in a completely foreign community during our courtship, holding my own, doing awesome work. but he just put me on an even higher pedestal...he even told me once that he wanted us to be able to put each other on podiums, and that he never will love someone for who they are (including himself) but only once their full potential has been actualized. to him, everything else was worthless. i had enough of an edge and assertiveness (in the beginning of course before he began to suck my will to live) that he built up this idea of my being a solid rock, completely independent (but of course not 'perfect' - 'no one is perfect' he would say)... either way, once my human tendencies including my issues with anxiety and depression and panic attacks surfaced, he was like, "um, no. you aren't the woman i fell in love with." of course he was allowed to throw his own bs my way, but, yeah, all about him. they like the alphas, he liked the fact that i went to a really competitive internationally/culturally focused college and graduated with an interesting and challenging degree. he liked that i was pleasant, "sweet" and caring, and pretty. he told me when he first saw me, he saw an "angel." i sure burst his miserable bubble. he's just a little boy that wants mom to take care of him, but mom's not allowed to have her own life. he's attached to you like an infant before being born, sucking the life out of you, and expecting to provide nothing in return. after all, he is god's gift to man. what are you unless you are kicking ass at life 100%; just another crazy unfortunate woman.

So completely true. In every aspect of my life I'm looked to for leadership, responsibility and advice - and appreciated for it! My narc used me to pay all the rent and our bills, cook, clean, and generally take care of EVERYTHING, which yes, I am fully capable of but should in no way have to do! I have soooo much free time now that he's gone and it's amazing! His OW is my complete opposite. Looks nothing like me, is a "free spirit" and barely has a personality of her own...one of those people who yes you to death and like everything you do. I'm sure he'll suck her dry in no time ::evil laugh::

but i can't....as i sit in this run down shack, i'm confronted with my failure to protect my pet's security from that monster.....protect their home from him..... everytime i think of BEN i'm confronted with my failure to protect my babies from that raging monster..... i was in the unusual situation of KNOWING he was a monster...HATING him...but being held virtual hostage by him.....i could have killed him any day......any day......and i knew it was the only way to stop him....the only way to really protect myself and my babies from him....was to kill him.....and i had thousands of chances...thousands upon thousands......and i failed to do it..... and no matter what stopped me each time...still i KNEW it was the only thing to do.......i despise a coward...and i see myself as a coward....not a day goes by that i am not reminded that if i had killed him.....he wouldn't have been able to murder BEN...that if i had killed him....he wouldn't have been able to destroy our home and my livlihood....i might be in prison...but there would have been enough money for my babies to have been taken care of in good style for the rest of their lives...everytime i pour them a bowl of cheap dog food....i'm reminded of my failures.....i should have killed him....even more than regret having met him...and married him.....i regret not killing him a long time ago..... Well I've been out walkin' I don't do that much talkin' these days These days These days I seem to think a lot About the things that I forgot to do And all the times I had the chance to These days I'll sit on corner stones And count the time in quarter tones to ten ... my friend Don't confront me with my failures I have not forgotten them -Jackson Browne “I do not bring forgiveness with me, nor forgetfulness. The only ones who can forgive are dead; the living have no right to forget." - Chaim Herzog

was just thinking 'i'm an alpha female' how could this have happened to me? so found your post interesting. have also thought recently that apart from his ex wife who's a fierce alpha, my N really likes people who are younger, more maleable than i am (tho god knows i've been a sucker), but of course a powerful appearing person more of a challenge - i see it now! think i'm beta after a yr with him anyway!

what i can't forgive myself for EVER is leaving BEN alone in a room with that monster.....even for a couple of minutes...because that's all it took for him to murder him..... and i can't forgive myself for killing the bastard in about 2000...when i came to completely realize it was the only way to ever keep my babies and myself safe from him...the only way to STOP him....... some things are unforgivable, i think........even when we do them,or fail to do them ourselves....... “I do not bring forgiveness with me, nor forgetfulness. The only ones who can forgive are dead; the living have no right to forget." - Chaim Herzog

i can't apply it to my ordeal with the psychonarc... you CANNOT forgive a Narc or a Psychopath...... but there are plenty of beautiful songs written about Narcs and Psychopaths that we can all weep to....... Rosanne Cash was in a long horrible marriage to Rodney Crowell and during that time she wrote many songs about being involved with an abusive asshole...two are my favorites are BLUE MOON WITH HEARTACHE...and COULDN'T DO NOTHING RIGHT...if you want to have a drink and hear some songs about how we've all lived.......pick up rosanne cash's SEVEN YEAR ACHE...or any of her early work...every song is about her misery with Rodney Crowell and about DUMPING him......Runaway Train...Man Smart Woman Smart..Seeing's Believing...On The Surface..Anybody's Darlin'..once you hear the heartbreak in her voice, you'll hate Rodney Crowell and wish him dead........ The lamp is broken on the mantle My mind is blown and I'm going away It's getting more than I can handle It's getting more than I can take I couldn't stay here if I wanted I couldn't stay here if I tried You were always so dissapointed in me I couldn't ever do nothing right And I worked hard to make a living To make the living good for you But you wanted more than I was giving I guess that was more than I could do I couldn't stay here if I wanted I couldn't stay here if I tried You were always so dissapointed in me I couldn't ever do nothing right ___________________________________ And Rosanne Cash singing John Hiatt's It Hasn't Happened Yet....it's one of my favorites...... You said that I would be sorry If you went away You said I wouldn't be happy Without hell to pay You said the teardrops would fall Between the bedroom walls You said that I would regret But it hasn't happened yet Your friends come over and offer To take me to eat They seem so sorry I'm sufferin' So much misery They say to just give a call Next time that I start to crawl I always say yeah you bet But it hasn't happened yet I don't have anyone I'm havin' fun Nobody's into me No one's a mystery I see you on the street My heart don't miss a beat Love and hostility Don't mean a thing to me I find it hard to remember The good times we had Call me insensitive Now that it's over, I'm glad You said when big shadows fell It would be too hard to tell My life from your silhouette But it hasn't happened yet Don't hold your breath, baby cause it hasn't happened yet “I do not bring forgiveness with me, nor forgetfulness. The only ones who can forgive are dead; the living have no right to forget." - Chaim Herzog

"Looks like Ns target women who tend to be independent- financially and otherwise" Wow is that ever true!!!! My N liked me partially because I am financially independent with a good creative job. He is a freelance musician and craves being recognized as a professional...he considers my achievements to be along the lines of what he wants..he would refer to me as a "professional" with a mixture of respect and envy. He also got me to do a few graphic art projects for him, and I knew what I was in for..he had no intention of paying me and was completely taking advantage of my talent. He also did this with a former artist GF who made good money but was emotionally weak and homely..to her, he was a boy toy come true. She bought him expensive gifts (new guitar) trips, dinners..and I saw him trying to slip into that mode with me. After a month I called a halt to the creative favors and said no more. I'm sure he was pissed off. Haha Oh well. He had a few people he knew in my field who did him some very nice favors and he always bitched about what they DIDN'T do for him..I couldn't believe it! Always what he DIDN'T get, not appreciating what he did get. I also told him I didn't want to be friends with him, which I am sure REALLY pissed him off..probably describes me as a bitch who wasn't even cool enough to want to stay friends. That's exactly how he sees things..always playing the victim, all his GF's are crazy, etc.

When I was involved with my ex-N,one of my friends observed that he (the ex-N,not the friend) was jealous of my ability to relate to people, having friends, being human, and my creative thinking. When my ex-N replaced me with my look-alike (she looked like me,except taller and with glasses),she made more $$$ than him and was a successful curator. She struck me as an alpha woman. I have an N coworker, and his girlfriend makes more $$ him, definitely has a better job. Looks like Ns target women who tend to be independent- financially and otherwise.

Definitely did him a favor. When I met him, I had just bought a house and he had just lost his job. He was living at an extended stay hotel, had (still has) bad credit, broke-ass, etc. I helped him out completely. It was a project I took on. Not because I was bored. Because I thought he liked me the way I liked him and that he would reciprocate once he got back on his feet. A year has passed and he's still looking for a job. He knew I was too good for him but never said it. Instead he played it off like he was doing me a favor by being with me. By letting me buy his dinner...I should be grateful or something. Hindsight is 20/20 indeed...

I had everything he WISHED he had...down to the truck I drove! My truck was the kind of truck all guys want...It had a lift with big tires, 4 Door, gooseneck hitch (to hook up trailers). He drove an average older model truck. I managed (fool probably thought I owned) a snooty coffee shop located at the center of our historic town. I had my apartment nicely furnished with leather couches & nice decorations. His apartment...ok, are you ready for this? HE HAD A LAWN CHAIR as living room furniture!!! Oh yes ladies, what a keeper!!!...I'm really not materialistic. I would have lived in a single wide trailerhouse with him (which I eventually did!) & been completely content if he would have been a normal person! I went from a very comfortable life style to a very dysfunctional poor life style with him! The poor part didn't bother me...it was the head games...& yet I was addicted to that!... Unbelievable!!!

yes i turned him down my friend tried to set us up b/c i thought he was too immature and aloof. ha i had better sense in me at 18 years. years later my second time around yes i was better looking, more accomplished, well off, advanced in my career and put together then him. he was still drinking, gambling, with bad credit...but he did a good job at hiding it!

I did. He was younger than me, but also long dreadlocks and really short. But he seemed soo cute, gentle and yet worldly and funny. I was definitely more sophisticated (he mirrored the worldly part I discovered), more lively, had a full interesting life with a lot of experience (good and bad). People have now asked what I was doing with him and that it just never seemed a match, that he was following me around. Peace. J

i know i was SMARTER than him........more HIP than him...more SOPHISTICATED than him.....but i'm not sure he knew it.... “I do not bring forgiveness with me, nor forgetfulness. The only ones who can forgive are dead; the living have no right to forget." - Chaim Herzog