Damned if you do, damned if you don't

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September 23, 2010 - 7:47pm (Reply to #69)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

Sure, it's an exercise in futility

to analyse the stuff they said and the stuff we said back. I know it's utterly pointless. I guess I was just mentioning it as a vehicle to get some of my anger out. I think sometimes it's only when you see these things in print that the utter lack of logic and coherency in what they say and do is truly apparent.
September 23, 2010 - 7:55pm (Reply to #70)
better off
better off's picture

Oh, don't feel like you

Oh, don't feel like you shouldn't get it out. Really, you sort of have to talk about it nonstop for a while because it's so weird. Eventually you will get sick of it. haha. I just meant you don't have to justify yourself or YOUR actions, or defend yourself. He's an ASSHOLE. This is worse than them ditching you in the first place... they can't bring themselves to say, I was a jerk, I used you, I can't commit because I always have to have someone new and "perfect"... so they blame you. The blaming is worse than the dumping. So I hope I didn't make you feel like you shouldn't complain about his bullshit as long as you want to.. I just meant, don't believe that doing anything differently would have changed the outcome. His "reasons" aren't valid, because the reason was him, and it's always going to BE him.
September 23, 2010 - 7:06pm (Reply to #66)
anonymous
anonymous's picture

What Else Can They Say?

"Because what else can they say? They can't say, I "loved" you insanely, now I feel nothing for you, I always do this, I'm an alien to the human race and I know it... ???" Wow Now I get it.
September 23, 2010 - 11:28pm (Reply to #67)
loveofmylife
loveofmylife's picture

I love you insanely

That's close to what mine used to say...his favorite line to me was: "I miss you madly!" And I would live for the moments when he would leave me vmails that said this or text me this. It would make my ENTIRE day! And his 2nd favorite line was: "You are violating my boundaries!" Note, this line was said about every week, when I did such offenses as - asking him out to lunch, when he had taken me to romantic dinners dozens of times. - telling him that I would accept a bribe to a baseball game, when he offered me the exact same bribe months earlier. I don't know if he has amnesia or if he actually believes that I am violating his boundaries. Does this make sense to anyone?
September 24, 2010 - 8:56am (Reply to #68)
better off
better off's picture

One of our songs was Truly,

One of our songs was Truly, Madly, Deeply. More like just "madly" since they're all mad. They're just nuts, girl. That's why you can't make any sense of it. They say whatever, whenever, for effect.
September 23, 2010 - 2:54pm (Reply to #65)
faith999
faith999's picture

better off

In all my research on narcissism, and let me tell you I have been reading about it for years, I have never seen it presented in the way you just did. BRILLIANT! How did i never see this? " Your wonderful experiences were just as much caused by his disorder as the bad ones... hard to take, but true. I wouldn't even KNOW this man if he wasn't a narcissist" For me this wasn't hard to take at all! I'm so grateful for this moment of clarity. Thank you!
September 22, 2010 - 8:00pm (Reply to #58)
helldweller
helldweller's picture

morty

Oh, boy, yes. I remember his birthday last year so vividly. I got up at five to go to the store to get stuff to make him breakfast. I made him french toast, his favorite, orange juice, coffee, sausage and bacon on Wednesday morning, with flowers, cards from my daughters and me, and a jar of hearts, one for each day of the year, each with a message saying something I love about him (yeah, I know, it took me like a year to think of them LOL). Anyway, I brought all this crap to his house at 8am on a tray and left it at the door for him and his child, because God forbid I should enter. That afternoon, I took him to the lake and we fed the ducks and I made a picnic with cocktails and, of course, came home and serviced him before going to pick up my kids at school That night, he claimed he had to work and couldn't let me take him to dinner, so stayed up and waited for him until two am so he could come over and have sex. He has never worked more than two hours at night and is always done by nine at the very latest. So I kept texting him, "I love you. Can't wait to see you" while I"m falling asleep, and he finally texts at 2, I'm on my way but just stopping in, so tired. So he stops in, doesn't even kiss me, downs a drink and goes home to bed with the flowers and presents I bought him. The next day, I asked if I could take him to dinner and he said, "I think so," but one of my tour guide's parents died so I had to work. I told him an hour after I asked him, and said I'd take him out the next night instead. "Forget it. Thanks a lot," he said. "If you can't even celebrate my birthday, what's the point of being together?" As it turned out, he couldn't go out the next day because he was planning on moving into "our" new house (without me) and going to dinner at the babysitter's house for his family birthday dinner. Needelss to say, I was not invited. So he had to make it my fault. Mind f*ck indeed.
September 23, 2010 - 2:49pm (Reply to #61)
better off
better off's picture

Helldweller, I wonder if

Helldweller, I wonder if you'd consider reading Adult Children of Alcoholics. I've never seen anyone try so hard to squeeze blood from a turnip! Even if he were semi-normal, this kind of give give give is over the top. A man won't let you inside his house... and your response is to get up at five to go to the store, make his favorite breakfast, add flowers and cards and a jar of hearts, one for each day of the year, each with a message saying something I love about him... that's 365 hearts!! And you couldn't even GIVE it to him because you can't go in. And then go on a picnic for lunch, and then give him sex, and then plan a dinner... For a person that basically tells you to fuck off every day. What is that message? I know you think that msg is I love you, ... but the msg is really, no matter how bad you treat me I will grovel at your feet and tell you how wonderful you are if you would just throw me a bone. JUST LOVE ME BACK!!! And if you did that for someone else you were dating they would probably run away in fear. That's smothering behavior... and, I am NOT saying this to be mean, it's not really all because of your love for him... it's because you are trying to GET love. Yet for some reason, you are trying to beg and plead and bribe and get this love from the person who's LEAST LIKELY to give it to you. Why?? Why have you chosen the biggest windmill in the valley to charge? Does it somehow not count unless you get it from the MOST unavailable person on earth? Do you have to win it from someone impossible for it to count to you? It's like you are trying to get water from a dry well, only you keep using a different bucket. The bucket isn't the problem.
September 23, 2010 - 2:36pm (Reply to #60)
Used
Used's picture

this reminds me, me and kids

this reminds me, me and kids used to make a real fuss of exh birthday, so one year i knew he was longing for an expensive metal detector,, i saved up and got we wrapped a big bow on it, he took the bow off, he said thankyou, it was about 8am left the house and spent the entire day[until it got dark] "detecting on a freinds land" by the time he came in it was kids bedtime.... what a man?then end of this should have read.... after the kids went to bed i said that was a bit shitty beign out all day with mental detector, he said you shouldnt have bought me it then,, we had an enormus garden, but he went elsewhere... in the end his f..king mdetector was left in the garden to get rusty, like his cars, like anything... who cares any more. not me.
September 22, 2010 - 8:53pm (Reply to #59)
anonymous
anonymous's picture

Helldweller - you've been through it

I can't even write the story of his birthday last year because I really don't want to go there. Suffice to say, just like you, I went to great lengths to let him know how much he was loved and I got shit on and D&Dd four weeks later. The anniversary of his b-day is coming up and I'm fearful that it will be the time on which he chooses to restablish contact. We've been NC since February - but he tried one 3rd party hoover attempt a couple of months ago. I've heard nothing since becasue I didn't bite .... but I've read that birthdays can be a trigger for them, especially if they have no fresh supply - which I don't think he does. So I'm a bit worried about it. I just want this all to end.
September 22, 2010 - 7:12pm (Reply to #44)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

And: the night of the D&D

And: the night of the D&D when I expressed utter incredulity that this was any kind of a reason to be ending the whole relationship, he said: "But I say things only once". In other words, if you didn't pick up on the fact that "I should get up and get on a treadmill" is code for "I want to leave here NOW and don't dare to interfere with today's timetable or ask me to do one single thing with you today, including having breakfast together, even though it's your birthday weekend" that's your own stupid fault. I say things only once and I have no concept of discussing different options or plans for the rest of the day. My day is cast in stone and you should realise that without me ever having to go to the trouble of spelling it out for you. Jesus. My brain is fried even trying to type all this out.
September 22, 2010 - 9:04pm (Reply to #45)
anonymous
anonymous's picture

I Say Things Only Once

Well - at least you have proof that he is a narcissist and you can wipe away any self-doubt or guilt you may feel in diagnosing him. Who the fuck actually believes that shit? I say things only once. Who are you, the fucking King? (Or should I say Queen?) =) I think we're across the pond from each other ... but not sure if you ever watched the BBC version of Pride and Prejudice? If you did, picture Elizabeth Bennett saying to Mr. Darcy "Had you behaved in a more gentlemanlike manner." That's my shoulda, coulda, woulda if I could do it all over. Be Lizzie Bennett. ;-)
September 23, 2010 - 2:25am (Reply to #46)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

Yeah Morty...

...the night I called to his place four months after being dumped, and he said the "I say things only once" line, I said "It's a RELATIONSHIP, not the army" Which I thought was a pretty good comeback ;) OMG. I literally just got through watching the BBC Pride and Prejudice! While Jane Austen is my heroine, and I adore watching this, it also made me so sad, because here is Lizzy sticking to her principles and telling Darcy to shag off, and all he can think about is getting back into her good books. She gets everything she wants/needs at the end of the day, just for being herself and sticking up for her own beliefs and principles. She is completely unafraid of him and teases him whenever she feels like it, and he reacts like a normal man - amused and slightly embarrassed by his own pomposity. She uses gentle humour to make a point and he GETS IT. Unlike a narc, who would explode with rage if you slagged them off even in an affectionate way. Or else, like mine, wouldn't, but would store up the rage and instead use it to D&D you months later. She is so loved and appreciated and adored by him by the end of the series, FOR REAL, and likewise. The contrast with my own life was just too much to bear. It is THE perfect love story, however. PS: Lady Catherine de Bourgh was clearly a narc though, don't you think? :)
September 23, 2010 - 2:35pm (Reply to #47)
better off
better off's picture

But it's NOT REAL!! It's a

But it's NOT REAL!! It's a book. I once saw a hilarious blog titled something like Edward Fucking Darcy Is Ruining My Life. So while we don't want to accept wankers like narcs, we also have to get "perfect love stories" out of our heads too.. because that's how these losers weasel their way in... by pretending to be Mr Darcy.... and doing everything he can to get into her good books (or pants). Because the sequel to that story would be him reverting back to the guy she told to shag off. Sense and Sensibility is a better story... where dashing Willoughby is the narc, her soulmate, and he absolutely crushes her.. and she is not interested in the "boring" Captain, but he's the one who truly loves her, and actually cares for her when she's ill, and wants the best for her. And in the end, she actually cares for him too. He won her with true, sacrificial love, and on their wedding day, stupid selfish Willoughby sits watching on his horse feeling regret I guess we're supposed to think. Boo fucking hoo, Willoughby!! lol
September 23, 2010 - 7:55pm (Reply to #55)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

But there was a narc in Pride and Prejudice as well...

it was the army guy who ran off with the youngest sister. He'd been grooming Lizzy up until then but she escaped at the last minute because Darcy told her all about his (the army guy's) shady past. In fact, I think a narc (also known as a cad or a bounder in those days :) features in most of Jane Austen's novels. I bet they got away with shit a WHOLE LOT more than now as well, because of the hugely inferior position of women in society back in the 1700s. Mr Darcy wasn't a narc - ok fine, he was a snob at the start and he was a loner, but he was ultimately honest and showed that he could change and grow. Which he did, as did Lizzy. Darcy started off being incredibly rude and cold to Elizabeth and everyone else in the town, in contrast to a real narc who, as we know, pulls out all the stops in the beginning to ensure that you think he's truly wonderful.
September 23, 2010 - 8:17pm (Reply to #56)
anonymous
anonymous's picture

Got Away with It More Then?

"I bet they got away with shit a WHOLE LOT more than now as well, because of the hugely inferior position of women in society back in the 1700s." I'm not so sure. I think back then, society spurned narcs. Sure women were treated like property and such, but there was the concept of honor. Today - we encourage individualism to the point of only looking out for number one. I think our way of living actually encourages narcissism, especially in men. And I think men get away with just as much, only now it's far more covert and mind-fucking.
September 23, 2010 - 8:25pm (Reply to #57)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

Actually, you're absolutely

Actually, you're absolutely right. That in fact is what made me cry at the end when I watched it recently. The sense of honour, society-wide, also contributed to Darcy getting his head out of his ass and doing his damndest to make it up to Elizabeth. Right on.
September 23, 2010 - 4:53pm (Reply to #48)
Meadowbrook
Meadowbrook's picture

Willoughby

I've thought about that story quite a bit lately. My narc was my Willoughby and my husband is the Captain. He has truly "won" me with his love and I'm holding onto hope that God will provide the spark that was missing in the past. Even if it never "feels" the way being "in love" with the narc felt, I know this is the real thing.
September 23, 2010 - 7:23pm (Reply to #52)
anonymous
anonymous's picture

Meadowbrook

I'm exactly where you're at. I just started reading Keeping the Love You Find and it talks about this. I'm not sure I'll ever get the *spark* back with my husband - in fact I know I won't because that would mean going back 12 years .... But I do know this - no one has ever loved me, truly loved me, as much as he does. As boring as he may be.
September 24, 2010 - 12:51pm (Reply to #53)
Meadowbrook
Meadowbrook's picture

Morty

Thanks for the recommendation of that book. I've been looking for something similar so I'll definitely check it out. I read your story and can relate. Amazing contrast between REAL love and FAKE love. I am learning to hold onto what is real and the allure of the fake is slowly, slowly fading.
September 24, 2010 - 12:55pm (Reply to #54)
anonymous
anonymous's picture

Slowly

I just wish slowly would hurry up. !
September 23, 2010 - 7:14pm (Reply to #49)
anonymous
anonymous's picture

It's True - I Thought He was My Mr. Darcy

But, Colin Firth aside (tee hee), Darcy is actually a wanker (you Brits have the best slurs). I have always loved P&P but always had a niggling thought in the back of my head that Lizzie really wouldn't end up happy in her marriage to Darcy. Gotta read S&S again - it's been a while. Sounds the like my husband might be the Captain. And the Narc, well he's definitely Mr. Wickham. >:-)
September 23, 2010 - 7:58pm (Reply to #50)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

Dude. Who you calling a Brit?! ;)

I'm Irish, me! The narc was (is?) a Brit but was constantly bitching about England. Hated it with a passion. And yeah! Mr Wickham. That's the one I was thinking of.
September 24, 2010 - 12:36pm (Reply to #51)
anonymous
anonymous's picture

OOOOOOPS

Bad assumption. Damn Brits! (just KIDDING) I'm American but got both English and Irish blood. No wonder I'm all F'd up. ;-)
September 22, 2010 - 7:04pm (Reply to #42)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

What I SHOULD have done....

....was, when he made the passive-aggressive remark about neither he nor his father liking "being told what to do" (narc code for "you've just made me come for breakfast with you, when I didn't want to but would NEVER DREAM of actually telling you that), was to give him a big, beaming, TOTALLY FALSE smile, a big kiss on the cheek and a big hug, and say, all bright and breezy and loud and false and brittle: "OK BABE, HAVE A GOOD DAY'S TRAINING!!" and turn on my heel and walk back into the apartment without a backward glance. That's what I should have done. Of course, if I'd done that, I would have been accused of being rude, ignoring him, being a psycho, and god knows what else. Again, damned if you do, damned if you don't. I'm beginning to think that should be the new name for this forum!
September 22, 2010 - 8:58pm (Reply to #43)
anonymous
anonymous's picture

Shoulda, coulda, woulda

I have so many of those moments now that I can see clearly where I shoulda just walked out on him. That's what NC had really helped with. Perspective. Seeing where I was abused. Where I was taken for granted and taken advantage of. I truly feel now that I was emotionally raped. I actually implied that to him after the D&D. I told him how hurt I was that he intervened in my life, got me to admit how unhappy I was in my celibate marriage - how he encouraged me to be sexual with him and then how he'd D&D'd me but still wanted me to be his platonic best friend. It was so fucking insensitive and played on every single vulnerability I had. His response? "The fact that you feel victimized by me is pure crap." Nice. Asshole. Oh yeah - when he D&D'd me, he actually said, "just don't make me feel like an asshole."
September 22, 2010 - 6:09pm (Reply to #40)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

Morty....

....heh heh! I guess they all have "hidden shallows"!!
September 22, 2010 - 5:59pm (Reply to #38)
anonymous
anonymous's picture

PS - before I knew was NPD was

Forgot - just like you.... came to that same conclusion and said those same things long before I knew what NPD was. In fact, I didn't figure out he was NPD until about four months after he D&Dd me. And it's telling how I figured it out ... my best friend says this is a huge deal: that a mutual GUY friend of ours was the one to point out to me that there's something not right about him and it goes beyond "mere" bi-polar. Our mutual GUY friend said, "I don't know what his problem is, but he had one and it's something to do with being too selfish and only concerned about number one." So I googled those phrases and low and behold, that's how I landed on NPD. My best friend says the fact that it was a GUY who pointed this out to me means a lot.
September 24, 2010 - 11:49am (Reply to #39)
Meadowbrook
Meadowbrook's picture

Morty - Google

I figured it out before mine had a chance to D&D me. I googled "does not give gifts" and "teases women" and up popped NPD and my road to clarity! During my reading I had so many "dings" where things he did matched up exactly with NPD and several with sociopath/psychopathology which freaked me out even more. But it helped me deal with him toward the end and probably helped me break free with somewhat less damage than I might have had otherwise. Thank God for Google?! :-)
September 18, 2010 - 7:49am (Reply to #33)
Susan32
Susan32's picture

Lack of fair procedures

The ex-Psych professor justified his one-sided behavior because he was the teacher and I was the student. When I found out about the fiancee, he got mad and said his engagement was "private",he acted like it was some invasion of privacy. He claimed I had put him in an "awkward position." I told him he was FREE to tell me he had already met someone. During my junior year, when I was casually dating, he was complaining to his students on class time... but would tell me to my face "I don't want to talk about it." I felt the same way during the D&D, of me and the relationship being thrown away without me having a voice (and he knew he was free to talk) Emotionally, intellectually, it's painful.
September 17, 2010 - 8:54pm (Reply to #30)
anonymous
anonymous's picture

Read Living with the Passive Aggressive Male

and you'll have a better understanding of why he didn't, or couldn't, talk to you about his feelings. That's not to make excuses for his behavior - it's just to understand. And for you to come to the conclusion that even if he had decided to keep you around, HE wouldn't have been worth the effort YOU would have had to keep pouring into the relationship. You are truly better off without him, as hard as that may seem to believe right now.
September 18, 2010 - 7:44am (Reply to #31)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

Good plan, will check it

Good plan, will check it out. Also, when dumping me, when I asked why he couldn't have told me about this when he started to feel this way, he cruelly said that in a previous relationship he had always been able to talk to the girl about his feelings/their relationship etc, but with me he felt he couldn't. Which made me feel like some kind of horrible scary bitch or something.
September 20, 2010 - 5:25pm (Reply to #32)
ShaynasMommy
ShaynasMommy's picture

OMG

what a bunch of bullshit do they really think we are that stupid? scrap his ass!
September 17, 2010 - 7:56am
helldweller
helldweller's picture

damned

Gosh, this brings back memories. So many memories of trying to "give him space" after he pushed me away only to have him say, "See! You don't love me! You don't call me! You don't text me! You don't want to see me!" You absolutely cannot win. When I dumped him in January and started seeing someone else (after three years of neglect and abuse AND his total abandonment of our plans to marry and have children), he said, "See, it's a good thing I didn't marry you because you left me for someone else. It's a good thing we weren't married already when you found someone you liked bettter." WTF???????????????????????????????????
September 17, 2010 - 7:53am
helldweller
helldweller's picture

damned either way

After he started d&d ing me, he started saying, "You're mad all the time, you're mean all the time" etc. and I just decided to start over and be my happy, outgoing self, seeing my friends with or without him, dressing up, writing, accomplishing, chatttering about my great life. This made him even more unhappy with me, made him hate being with me even more. The thing he hated most was when I accomplished something. The last book I wrote was dedicated to him and he refused to congratulate me when it came out. Refused. He later told me it was because I didn't mention him by name in the dedication. I wrote "To D" instead of his whole name. Interestingly, the last book I wrote I thanked him by name in the acknowledgements and he had a fit, telling me I am full of drama because I like "parading his business in front of everyone." Can't win for losing.
September 17, 2010 - 6:10pm (Reply to #26)
Susan32
Susan32's picture

No win situation

The same happened here. The ex-Psych professor hated it when I accomplished things as well. It turns out his colleagues liked me DESPITE all his trash talk... I was happily surprised when I looked at my transcript after graduation. With the exception of math, I had gotten good grades. And he had gone around saying how stupid I was.... who got the last laugh now?LOL... My senior essay advisor complimented me recently on my writing. A very sweet professor (not the romantic way, just a very good man) I don't bother acknowledging the ex-P in my writing. AT ALL. Haven't dedicated anything to him. Haven't sent him ANY thing saying "Thanks for being my inspiration" or "your writings on Wittgenstein and religion light the way." Haven't acknowledged his "achievements" either. I used to congratulate him, urge him on... but no more. I'm no longer around to tell him to meet his potential. He never acknowledged MY achievements, so why should I acknowledge his, unless in jest?
September 17, 2010 - 10:05am (Reply to #25)
better off
better off's picture

double bind

My therapist calls that the double bind.
September 17, 2010 - 7:53am
helldweller
helldweller's picture

damned either way

After he started d&d ing me, he started saying, "You're mad all the time, you're mean all the time" etc. and I just decided to start over and be my happy, outgoing self, seeing my friends with or without him, dressing up, writing, accomplishing, chatttering about my great life. This made him even more unhappy with me, made him hate being with me even more. The thing he hated most was when I accomplished something. The last book I wrote was dedicated to him and he refused to congratulate me when it came out. Refused. He later told me it was because I didn't mention him by name in the dedication. I wrote "To D" instead of his whole name. Interestingly, the last book I wrote I thanked him by name in the acknowledgements and he had a fit, telling me I am full of drama because I like "parading his business in front of everyone." Can't win for losing.
September 16, 2010 - 5:10pm
Susan32
Susan32's picture

Hating it when I was happy

The ex-Psych professor AVOIDED me when I was happy... especially when I was dating. He voiced his displeasure... to his students... on class time. If he stood me up at a concert or lecture, he'd say the next day snarkily, "Go be with your friends" or "I'm not THAT important." (A normal guy doesn't mind it if his girlfriend/wife or platonic lady friend hangs out with her friends--he just doesn't) After he D&D'd me and I met his girlfriend, I was able to coldly explain to him what he had done... with a huge, self-righteous grin on my face. When he commanded me to stop smiling, I stretched it to a Joan Rivers magnitude. It was nice to see HIM writhe in pain and go nuts, for once. And he acted like he had ZERO vulnerabilities and would intone "I'm controlling my feelings."
September 16, 2010 - 2:09pm
The Girlfriend ...
The Girlfriend of Dr Jekyl's picture

YES! You are really getting it!

oop's double post! see below :-)
September 16, 2010 - 2:11pm
The Girlfriend ...
The Girlfriend of Dr Jekyl's picture

YES! You are really getting it!

Funsize, already in just a few short days you seem to be quickly understanding the complexities of being with a Narcissist and I for one am glad to see you doing this...coz educating ourselves about this personality disorder/character flaw helps us know it isn't our fault...and helps us to be able to restore 'who we are'...vs. THEM! Sometimes we get stuck somewhere between blaming ourselves and being confused...and it being THEIR problems and messed up view of the world.(truth!) So glad you don't seem to be wondering 'if it was you'...as so many of these blood-sucking psycho's leave us feeling like that...and so confised about WTF 'Just happened'... In answer to your question...if I may...since I am sort-of a veteran here for almost a year...YES YES YES...these deranged dudes absolutely WILL D & D you...it is a guarantee in all realtionships with them...and they absolutely look for some of the most 'bubbly' (happy) sweet, loving, pretty, accomplished, intelligent women to have their 'quasi-relationships' with (to us it is REAL...but to them...well,we are only 'supply'...a difficult concept to grasp...but once you do...it makes things easier to 'get' about these creeps) They WILL D&D you no matter how wonderful, smart,gorgeous, educated, well paid, rich/poor, healthy...or have the flu at the moment!...in fact they are even more likely to eventually D&D us at a time we may need them the most! (such as during a 'loss' we may experience...or an injury or illness)...They 'act' like the most loving guy you would ever meet...like they will ALWAYS care about everything about YOU...and that they value you completely...and once they have you deeply involved...they will 'cycle' their behavior & 'feelings' up and down...(roller coastering, one minute they are happy...they next they are distant and critical)...to keep you confused and off-balance. Some of them may seem 'mild' compared to others...but in the end...each of these guys does damage to the person they are in relationship with in many ways. They all share similar twisted ways of thinking and relating and behaving...but may vary in intensity...etc. I think I mentioned this somewherebefore, but look at the story of Christie Brinkley (she is STILL dealing with her EX H-Narc who is currently using the court system and media to D & D her and continue devastating her life)(control)... Also, there is Sandra Bullock, Elizabeth Hurley...and many many other bright, bubbley, talented, wonderful, gorgeous gals...who also had everything going for them...NO one is immune to the damage these guys do (celebrity, status, appearance, position, wealth...it does not matter!)...and YES! They usually go after the very best of us...only later to leave us in taters... it is their modis operandi. You are in good company here! We share such similar experiences to one degree or other... It is NOT your fault what happened. You did nothing wrong to deserve what he did...it is so hard to sort through the lies he told and the facade and dream he captured you with...and figure out the truth. It IS all about HIM! xo
September 21, 2010 - 12:03am (Reply to #20)
cluelessuntilnow
cluelessuntilnow's picture

The Girlfriend

Thanks for your post. I learn so much from others views and posts. My exN D&D'd me when as you wrote "I needed him the most".Just to see your post gave me some comfort.
September 16, 2010 - 4:24pm (Reply to #12)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

Cheers for the vote of

Cheers for the vote of confidence, GF! I guess I was reading on this site and others long before I actually applied to become a member of it. I know I started this reading sometime in the summer (I was dumped in March) but I can't remember what triggered my wondering whether he was a narc or not. I think it was because a previous guy I dated behaved in a similar fashion (I got the hell out of there after 2 months) and after that breakup a friend of mine suggested that he might be a sociopath since she had had a similar experience herself. I guess I started reading up on this kinda stuff two years ago so was familiar enough with it before now, but just didn't realise that narcissism was an actual pathology in its own right. But even knowing that my latest narc might be the same, it still HURT LIKE ALL HELL to be dumped by him, and traded in for this stupid ugly bitch. There were days I didn't get out of bed; days I didn't leave the apartment; days I just wanted to die. I feel so much better these days and even if he did come crawling back full of apologies and declarations of love, or even friendship, I don't think I would be able to believe a word out of his mouth. I don't mean that I would CHOOSE not to believe him; what I mean is that I have literally lost the ability to believe anything he says, even if I wanted to. It's like learning a language - over time you gradually forget it unless you are using it on a regular basis, to the point where eventually you lose the ability to put a sentence together in that language, no matter how much you want to. I used to imagine him coming back and us both crying with happiness at being reunited but now I think I would just sit across from him and stare coldly at him (the way he did to me on our last meeting) in complete silence and let himself talk himself into the ground. I really don't know what would convince me of his good faith. An engagement ring? Maybe, but that's no proof that he won't leave again or cheat, or just be a lousy partner, or emotionally LIE TO ME for three months by constantly saying "I'm always ok" while in reality seething with silent hatred of me. Him getting me pregnant? Ditto, plus then he'd probably start to use baby fat as an excuse for no sex. Even if he wasn't a narc, even if he was just a regular assclown who took up with someone else very quickly after me, I would have issues with that.
September 17, 2010 - 8:10pm (Reply to #19)
faithinthefuture
faithinthefuture's picture

Yeah i remember

those days of hurting like hell! Not being able to function, leave the house, go to work, to have any thought in my head except for HOW THE HELL COULD HE DO THIS?(he cheated on me when he went to his home state 600 miles away for a funeral & came back to me like he did nothing wrong) It wasn't until I read a txt of his to her & questioned him. He told me she was a figment of his imagination and then said they were just friends...he commented about her long sexy legs...words he said to me. I'm 5'8" she's 5'3". Then 1 month later I was told he was with her cuz she was telling everyone. He still denied it! funsize I'm with you. If he told me it was sunny outside I would have to go look and if I ever see him again(I told him to go back home after I found he cheated)I wouldn't believe a single word that came out of his mouth. not even hello! Reading this today gave me so much hope and strength that when I go to see my daughter next month in his town & if I should see him I will ignore him & should he try to talk to me I will look at him with cold empty eyes not say a word and walk away from him. And be thankful he's never to be a part of my life again. Your words helped me today and I just want to say thank you.
September 16, 2010 - 4:25pm (Reply to #13)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

But wait: if it's all just

But wait: if it's all just about supply, then why do they give a flying fuck what we look like or what our personalities are like?
September 20, 2010 - 5:33pm (Reply to #14)
ShaynasMommy
ShaynasMommy's picture

because supply = food

would you rather have a burger and fries or steak tartar and all the gourmet fixin's? besides that, we were all big game supply, which is why a lot of us complain here that our Narcs left us for some dumb ugly bimbo. They can't keep up with the big game for long, so they have to settle for poaching rabbits sometimes.
September 20, 2010 - 7:13pm (Reply to #15)
gettinbetter
gettinbetter's picture

"The Big Game"

Exactly! It really wears them out with the competition being you and others looking at you. While it makes them feel good to have an attractive woman it also creates alot of anxiety and destabilizes them. When you have constant anxiety and we all know this. You feel tired all the time. Its no different for them. I think thats why alot of have to step back and take a break with someone less attractive so they can recharge their energy without worrying about someone snatching their supply
September 22, 2010 - 2:29am (Reply to #16)
hooklineandsinker
hooklineandsinker's picture

Yeah, your man Sam Vaknin

Yeah, your man Sam Vaknin talks a lot about that - the cycle of frenetic activity with almost catatonic tiredness. Makes sense that they need to recharge from time to time. It's also a comforting thought, that I'm not really that horrendous that he would throw me over for such an ugly bore. It was for a different reason entirely.
September 22, 2010 - 10:39am (Reply to #17)
gettinbetter
gettinbetter's picture

Sam Vaknin

I know he is controversial but I think he's dead on. I know he is an N and in true N fashion we are his supply as we voraciously read his stuff in search of answers. He is cerebral and gets off knowing that he holds the answers we need. I do think though that he speaks the truth and he knows it
September 24, 2010 - 12:27pm (Reply to #18)
Meadowbrook
Meadowbrook's picture

Sam V

Totally agree about him. My jaw almost dropped to the floor while reading his stuff because it was so dead on. I don't care if I am supply to him. His writings have enlightened me greatly.