Do they treat the next wife/girlfriend better?

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#1 July 11, 2010 - 6:32pm

Do they treat the next wife/girlfriend better?

Do they learn anything from past mistakes and treat the next one any better? I believe that my exNH has secured new supply and still think that maybe it was just me and that we truly weren't a match for one another. He has patterns that I have seen from his past relationships that he does not see at all but the last blow up we had (25 days NC) he sent me a text saying to me: "You are right. I have a lot of issues that have hurt you and I am going to heal myself so that I do not hurt another girl the way I have hurt you." So will this new girl reap the benefits of a "healed" man/boy while I was the one who reaped the abuse?

July 9, 2012 - 7:54am



July 6, 2012 - 7:00pm


ABSOLUTELY NOT, not in a million years, not in this life time or the next, -

July 4, 2012 - 8:38am

Please read the Post "Well I

Please read the Post "Well I have seen it all come full circle" Your question will be answered right there. I have had this man in and out of my life for 25 years.

July 4, 2012 - 9:53am (Reply to #31)


July 3, 2012 - 3:46pm


I sincerely appreciate and welcome your input. Yes, agreed that I am STUCK in the obsession mode of fixating on the OW and how she is going to be the ONE WOMAN who will make my exn happy in life where I failed. I have prayed and prayed about this and read and read every topic on the other woman I could find thus far and most of what I have found is that it leans more towards the OW not lasting at some point either. That there is NO perfect woman for the narcissist and his perfect changes from week to week sometimes. As long as he finds value in this woman (that is where I falter) he WILL stay with her. She will NOT give him up no matter what and I fully believe and from what I SEE he does NOT treat her too badly (been a year). She has LOTS of money and does not work and has sooooo much time to dote on him and make him feel special like he wants to feel. I was tired and run down and felt under appreciated and the type that voiced it. This woman wouldn't say s--t if she had a mouthful of it from what I have heard. She is so nice it is almost to the fake extreme from what some of our mutual friends have said. Even my exn told me in the beginning when i asked about her he said she was NICE. Like I was a monster I suppose.
Anyway, I'll cut it short. I KNOW I'm not healing and that is my point. I WANT to end this obsession but it is almost like I will HAVE TO SEE it with my own eyes that they aren't going to make it last and be happy before I can MOVE ON. Believe me, I know this could take YEARS. This is why I'm so desperate to learn of ways to make it happen. I've tried many many things and to no avail. It has been temporary fixes, but the same obsession comes right back. As for my daughter, thank you and I'm secure she loves me and I know it is just a jealous thing about ow. I guess I feel like OW got my husband, my house, my dog and now my daughter whenever she wants. I know, life isn't fair, but it is more than I can take sometimes.

July 12, 2010 - 4:34pm

RE: Do they...


This it's interesting that the N you formerly dated too was hospitalized as a youth for psychological issues.

Mine was also and was forthright in telling me about the experience.

He'd attempted to commit suicide.

When he criticized me for falling into a depression (my first ever), it crossed my mind that he might be projecting the judgmental attitudes he was subjected to onto me...

He had no compassion and in fact acted disgusted. Like I was contagious or something.

July 12, 2010 - 4:11pm

They don't change, they just

They don't change, they just change their victims.

Ending the dance

July 12, 2010 - 4:17pm (Reply to #25)

They become worse

My ex-Psychopath professor was MORE honest at the outset of the "relationship" than he was at the end. I let him get away with waaay too much. He got away with deception, standing me up (multiple times) and outright verbal abuse.

He is one of those rare psychopaths who KNOWS he has a problem. His parents took him to the Worcester Insane Asylum/State Hospital as a child.

He was cruel to me when my grandfather died;I don't think he was compassionate when the OW was pregnant with twins.

July 12, 2010 - 4:36pm (Reply to #26)

Re: They become worse


This it's interesting that the N you formerly dated too was hospitalized as a youth for psychological issues.

Mine was also and was forthright in telling me about the experience.

He'd attempted to commit suicide.

When he criticized me for falling into a depression (my first ever), it crossed my mind that he might be projecting the judgmental attitudes he was subjected to onto me...

He had no compassion and in fact acted disgusted. Like I was contagious or something.

July 12, 2010 - 4:47pm (Reply to #27)

Some clarification

My ex-P and I didn't date... but we were viewed as a couple. He was my professor;I was the student. I saw him as a friend... and as a potential boyfriend. He freaked people out with his cold lack of emotions. His colleagues steered clear of him (one simply called him "different"--well, that's polite),and his students thought he was scary (they also mocked and hated him) His reaction to a physical injury in the lab scared my classmates and I. He was totally numb to it.

When my ex-P claimed he had gone on a European vacation (turns out it was a pure fabrication),he said he didn't want to go to Turin, because he was afraid he'd go nuts (Nietzsche fell into full-blown schizophrenia from syphilis there)

When I had my ex-P as my freshman lab teacher, he was sending me to the therapist to "manage my feelings." Turns out it was crazy-making. And major projection.

My ex-P was sent to Worcester State Hospital... and it's a creepy looking place. Now only the clock tower and the turret remain. It looks straight out of a horror movie.

July 12, 2010 - 2:46pm

Someone's already said this

I'm sure . . . but I WAS the next wife/girlfriend.

And he treated me like shit too.

The Narc did not "begin" his Narcissism with me. And he won't end it with me either. There are few predictabilities in life; the Earth spinning on it's axis, the seasons, and a Narc always being a Narc.

July 9, 2012 - 7:58am (Reply to #23)

absolutely! well said Briseis

absolutely! well said Briseis nice to see youre free.7º

July 12, 2010 - 4:07pm (Reply to #22)

Great point, Briseis!

"There are few predictabilities in life; the Earth spinning on it's axis, the seasons, and a Narc always being a Narc."

July 12, 2010 - 1:34am
CarolKittyGale (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

They never change

'They were never really there for us anyway,so the only thing really missing from our life since they are gone is their physical presence.'......exactly Staying Strong78....that is it in a nutshell. I'm much happier without my ex.

Mine went out of his way to tell me he was going to treat the new woman better then he treated me...why be cruel and have no empathy and tell me...if he had changed surely he would have not been able to do that? So you see they NEVER change just learn new tricks and eventually the REAL them comes out in the open. Familiarity breeds contempt with the N as far as I'm concerned.

Past behavior is an indicator of future behaviour.

July 11, 2010 - 10:25pm

he said the same thing to

he said the same thing to me...the first time he left...that he had learned and wanted things to be different and was going to drink less and treat this girl well. i was so insanely jealous that all my hardwork and this new girl would reap the benefit. well i know he was lying to her, and after it ended, he came back right to me. also i had the privelege of seeing few of her emails when i snooped around..and even in that short three months she was asking how are we going to make this work. the second time he left i got the same talk, it was me, and hes going to be happier with someone else. although its really hard when they say this, i think everyone is right, once the honeymoon wears off, they will be the same. if the girl expects intimacy...there will be problems.

July 11, 2010 - 10:37pm (Reply to #11)

I think we all have wandered

I think we all have wandered if the next girl will be the "one"....because we still were thinking WE were the problem.

The thing is these men aren't just occassional rude asses. They have huge flaws in their CHARACTER and those things are ingrained permanently

Yes, people learn and grow from age and experiences, but some things aren't "learned", you either have it or you don't

The fact they don't have empathy, IMO, is the root of the problem. It's what makes them selfish, able to abuse/manipulate, treat people as objects.

They just learn to fake empathy, but they don't have it.

Not with ANYONE. and you cannot have a relationship with someone who lacks empathy. Impossible.

July 11, 2010 - 11:01pm (Reply to #12)

Do they treat the next wife/girlfriend better?

This totally makes sense.

I too had some of the same thoughts: what if I really was a problematic person and some other girl out there was the 'real deal'?

I'd read books, held my tongue and done everything I possibly could, thinking I could somehow be 'the one' for him with complete disregard to the question of whether or not he really was 'the one' for me!

It's crazy how I could get so caught up in trying my hardest at perfecting myself to be HIS ideal partner, when in fact virtually none of my needs were being met once I had an opportunity to honestly reflect on our relationship.

Once I found out about NPD and realized how serious it is, my insecurities became fewer and fewer because it's so true that this behavior is representative of

'...huge flaws in their CHARACTER...'

No book, no behavior change (at least on my part) could fix our relationship, because his lack of action, his lack of introspection, his lack of empathy were the problem(s).

Not me.

Not his exes.

And not any of the other women to come.

It was HIS personality disorder and ultimately HIM.

This realization made it clear that I was spared...spared the disrespect, humiliation, manipulation, etc. that those after me will undoubtedly endure.

So now, rather than envying the seemingly supreme treatment those who come after me may receive, I hope for them.

I hope they'll be wiser than I was and take heed of the signs rather than ignore them.

I hope they'll know that actions speak far louder than words and observe the way they are treated rather than what he 'promises'.

I hope they'll be smart enough to get out before too much if any, damage is done.

I truly hope, they'll become one less woman whose self-worth and identity has been put in the crosshairs.

I hope they know they're worth more and are smart enough to go and get more for themselves.

July 12, 2010 - 1:10am (Reply to #14)

Nope. The N is seriously

Nope. The N is seriously damaged goods. They are great at the initial fireworks but everything comes to an end. My ExN has a nine month rule before the initial D&D begins.
I have also been reading that their disorder gets worse with age. They become more destructive, unable to wear the masks for an extended period of time and even sometimes become more physically abusive due to the feelings of no control. So if this is the case, then it is only natural the the next person in succession to me would receive a dose worse than what i did. Now this doesn't make me feel better mind you. This is a scary thought that poor girl has no idea what is taking place at this very moment. We should worry for the OW. They are like we once were. Love struck and blind. What a scary thing. xoxoxo

only one way to go...Forward (tm?)

July 12, 2010 - 1:47am (Reply to #15)

No Way !!

In my situation, I will NEVER feel sorry for the OW. She was just as much to blame for all of this shit as he was !! She played games with me the whole time. She knew what she was doing, but lied thru her freaking teeth to me !! She lied to my N ( I mean big huge lies, not just little fibs), cheated on name it, but yet where is he at ?? I do believe she is an N as well. Not sure how a relationship between 2 N's would work out !! I hope they both just self combust one day !!

July 12, 2010 - 2:05am (Reply to #16)

I am sorry to hear that

I am sorry to hear that happy. It is possible she my be disorders as well. I know this is a difficult concept. But if this does hold any weight, than what she is going to experience is and will be worse. So chances are favorable that you will get your wish. In fact probable. This did not happen with me. The OW is a victim as well. I refrained from any contact with her so as to not stir the pot. I am sure she is loving the honeymoon phase now but as we know all good things will end with the N. So i do feel sorry for my OW. I really dont wish this abuse on anyone.
If your OW is an N then chances are that she unfortunately will not be affected by him. They will just ultimately self destruct and both will walk away as if it never took place. Or maybe there will be a homicide/suicide. Hard to say but in either case the entire situation is doomed b/c He is a N. This we know for sure.

only one way to go...Forward (tm?)

July 12, 2010 - 2:14am (Reply to #17)

Thanks Betty

I was not trying to be a bitch, but my situation just SUCKS !! I got played by both of them, so I have a hard time having any sympathy for either one. OMG--does that make me an N ?? :) NAH !! :) Just a sad soul left in the dust from all of this crap !! But I do believe THEY will get what they deserve. Two rotten people should just not be allowed any type of happiness. Uhmmmmmmm, ok.........I'm done, got that out of my system. :) Guess I am in the anger phase of recovery, huh ??

July 12, 2010 - 7:26am (Reply to #18)


I know how you feel, my ex (she) is with her boss, someone she has known for over 13 years.. oh, she 'loves him and he doesn't know it yet'.. yeh - i'm supposed to believe that crap.. she was quick to make a move on me when she knew i was single, that's how they work, no remorse, no empathy, and no i don't feel sorry for the boss he knew exactly what he was doing. Its OK to get angry, it's part of the process but we shouldn't hold on to the anger, in time that will pass and you'll heal. I promise. You will get better.
Past behaviour predicts future behaviour.

Just give it time, it happened before you, it happened with you, and it'll happen after you.

July 12, 2010 - 1:16pm (Reply to #19)


After the D&D (and meeting the girlfriend), I remember chillingly telling a friend, "I'm not his first victim... nor will I be his last." One of my friends said that my ex-Psychopath professor hadn't only preyed on me;she was sure he had done the same things to other women. It was part of a pattern.

My ex-P warned me from the outset that he had hurt a lot of people, that he'd let me down, and that "people think I'm a mean guy." He even told me about going to a mental hospital as a kid. His mask didn't stay on that long with me... but then again, I was a student.

I'm pretty sure he was able to keep the mask on longer with the OW because they had a long-distance relationship. They even got married.

What's weird is that my ex-P didn't even act as if he were in love with her. He didn't even put up an act for that. He coldly referred to his fiancee by her surname. He said "It shouldn't matter to you that I already have a girlfriend" (pure projection) and was hoovering me AFTER I met her.

My ex-P obviously had Mommy issues... now that his Mommy is living with him and raising his kids (AND him, tho he's almost 50),they're kinda resolved now, aren't they?

July 11, 2010 - 11:17pm (Reply to #13)

"It's crazy how I could get

"It's crazy how I could get so caught up in trying my hardest at perfecting myself to be HIS ideal partner, when in fact virtually none of my needs were being met once I had an opportunity to honestly reflect on our relationship."

So true!!!

They were never really there for us anyways, so the only thing really missing from our life since they are gone is their physical presence.

July 11, 2010 - 8:15pm

Change we can believe in?

When I met the OW (a nerdy, kindly woman from LA, a curator, who resembled me)--I did feel naturally jealous. She had told my ex-P professor that she loved him, she had moved in with him, she was engaged to him-- everything I had fantasized about. Here I was, left in the lurch. Naturally, I was jealous.

So I talked to one of my friends in the DC are about the D&D and how my ex-Psychopath professor treated me. She asked me if he had become worse over the years--I said yes. She asked how he had treated me during the D&D. I talked about the gaslighting, the public humiliation, the deception, the verbal abuse.

My friend said,"Don't be jealous" and "You're his student and treated you like cr@p. What makes you think he'll treat her better?" (I was NATURALLY assuming he was treating her better than me) Basically, I was his Waitress Test. At the time, it was tough talk. Now I realize it was tough love from my friend.

At the beginning of my "relationship" with my ex-P, my MOTHER had asked,"He's treating you badly as a student now. What makes you think he'd treat you better if you were his wife? He was cruel when your grandfather died. What makes you think he'd be nice if you were pregnant?"

My ex-P treated me brutally, especially towards the end. He hoovered me AFTER I called him a lying, arrogant bully;he acted romantically interested AFTER I had met the girlfriend.

I felt for the OW... and I could do nothing.

If the past holds the clue to the future... all I can say I was that I dodged the bullet of the future. The OW married my ex-P and had his kids. Whether or not they stayed together, I don't know. It's one of those things I'd rather not know.

July 11, 2010 - 6:43pm

The short answer NO

No no No No... mine went through the healing phase and while modifying his behavior, he never really changed, and the D&D never stopped. In fact he pointed to his healing to prove that he had only D&Dd me twice in 6 months. It wasn't like he was doing it all the time. He even told me he was such a changed man that his next relationship was going to be truly intimate and connected. I told him I felt sorry for the poor bitch already.

Mine dumped his ex rather savagely when he moved on to me, and like I recently said to a friend, "any woman that watches him treat his ex like crap and thinks he won't treat her the same is a friggin idiot. I will admit that's what I was"

Past behavior is an indicator of future behavior.


July 11, 2010 - 6:43pm

Oh my no no...It

Oh my no no...It gets worse. And its not you. Its them. They are disordered people. Please dont believe that he is changing or any happier with the new supply. Once the honeymoon is over stand the hell by. xoxo

only one way to go...Forward (tm?)

July 3, 2012 - 12:42pm (Reply to #2)


I know this is an old post but I read these often. I'm going through a rough time where I'm constantly obsessing over the ow. I was cheated on and divorced for this woman and they have been together for a year now and it all seems to be going great. they do not live together, but do every other week live together when she doesn't have her children. I have a young daugther I share equal custody time with and ow is caring for her all of the time and that also drive me nuts. How can someone you LOVED so much just kick you to the curb and replace you even before you know what the hell is going on?? Yet, he said he warned me and I just wouldn't change. OW has all of the qualities and then some and I hate it. I feel as though she is going to be the one who lasts.
So was hoping some of you had stories where the Other Woman seemed this way for awhile but fell from grace and eventually was terminated as well. Any help here would be wonderful!!!!

July 3, 2012 - 2:58pm (Reply to #3)


Thats a difficult situation with your precious daughter, but as her true mom you're the single most important thing in her world.

I too am haunted by the Other person, and its my insecurity thinking they will succeed where I failed. All the advice, Lisa's here too, is that N won't change, can't change, and I still find this so hard to accept. As Vaknin says 'a cooked tree will still grow, but will always be a crooked tree'.

Vaknin also says a Somatic N may partner with a Cerebral N, but never two of the same type. My exN is Somatic N and new partner is Cerebral N I'd guess (many previous young partners, separated from then partner and their kids when they were aged 3, dysfunctional and degenerate Art, egoist salesperson, ultra-vain, predatory etc). Not the case with your exN's OW.

Like you I got no warning, suddenly they were engaged 2-3 days after meeting and exN is now totally trapped with NS/N. Well, thats N's crazy choice. My love and care for exN is .. misdirected.

Two weeks or more of NC is starting to really work for me. I'm still trying to eliminate that nagging suspicion that exN is not N (when they are, no question). And that exN will get better, when ALL the advice is that they won't change.

So my success in disconnecting and destressing, is by simply not worrying too much (worrying less, let's say) about N and the Other person. The Other person gets exN, warts and all. You know the dynamic of N the person, and word is that won't change - to what extent she puts up with that is hard to guess. Whether the other person lasts or not, is not our concern now. Great that you and OW are there for the little one, and thats most important and perhaps where it ends.

I'm sorry this is so rambling and mostly about me, but its the outstanding thing in my recovery, the vain hope that exN will get better with NS or over time, that it'll work well where I failed. And I think thats not the point (we are, you and daughter), I think its wrong for exN to be the focus in any way, when they're History.

Yes, our situations are quite different - but I think I do understand. Hopefully others will contribute.

July 3, 2012 - 3:31pm (Reply to #4)

Costa, you are onto something here...

...and Cala, please please please dearheart try to understand that the longer you focus on her and his treatment of her the more you prolong your own healing and progress.

As Costa is realizing, OW is immaterial. I'm sure Costa knows that it is exceedingly disordered to get engaged within 2-3 days of healthy man (or woman for that matter) does that. It is doomed. Period.

In your case, dear Cala, he cheated on you with her and she cheated on her husband with him...what makes you think it will be any different in their relationship?

Cala, I see you have been a member here for a while. And your posts about OW indicate you are stuck on this. This is not productive at all and your energy spent obsessing about her is not serving YOU at all.

I, too, expended large amounts of energy "competing" with an OW I didn't even know about until four years into the so-called relationship. It was easier to focus on "beating her" in the game than to focus on what it WAS ABOUT ME THAT WOULD MAKE ME WANT A MAN WHO HAD OWs. What was it that I thought was "so great" about being manipulated, lied to, d & d'd again and again, triangulated, lied to, etc. etc.??? Until I was really willing to look at that I was literally "spinning" my wheels in futility.

Cala (and Costa), you have to become someone who no longer desires someone who unceremoniously dumps them, hooks up immediately and doesn't look back. You must become someone who does not "long for" someone who cannot see nor appreciate YOUR VALUE. Whatever he or OW are doing now is IMMATERIAL to the future you want to create! Cala, you will never be able to create that future if you are stuck in the past with them.

I hope you can consider this, dear Cala. It is said with compassion and love. I have walked in your shoes and wasted much time and energy focusing on anything but what I truly needed to do to change...once I shifted that focus, the CHANGE THAT HAS COME HAS BEEN EXCELELNT, beautiful, amazing, joyful, and liberating! Honestly!



July 3, 2012 - 7:33pm (Reply to #5)


I didn't ask. HOW did you get past your obsession with ow and fact that exn just dumped you for her with not looking back. Well, mine looked back. For about 9 months after we split we still slept together and I became the ow. I had to stop in Jan. of this year. Couldn't be ow.
What things helped make your life become excellent and joyful now? What one thing or things did you do to put your focus on you and OFF them when they are there. I have it in my face on a weekly basis so hard to nc and ignore them. Any advice is appreciated. I know that I have to for my own mental health get past caring so much about what happens with him and ow. The truth of it is he didn't and doesn't want me.

July 8, 2012 - 5:15pm (Reply to #6)

I'll weigh in here

My exnarch and (I believe) Narc OW have been together at least since a few weeks after he moved out. But, they always had a thing for each other, I saw it for years and once I decided it was over...he and she wasted no time getting together. She was actually still engaged to another guy when she and my Exhnarc got together. So it all happened pretty fast. D12 and I were reeling with grief of our family being blown apart, and he was already onto next family. Within a few months of him moving out, he began taking daughter to be wiht OW and her small daughters. It was ENORMOUSLY painful for my daughter, and their actions have never let up. They have even gone so far as to tell her that "its time" to move on and get over it. SHE NEVER HAD TIME TO GRIEVE. But this is who they BOTH are. answer your question. I have been able to move on precisely because their selfish, self absorbed, childish behavior pushed me over to the other side. I DO NOT WANT anybody in my life who could so easily move on after being toghether 18 years and hurt - and continue to hurt - his daughter. I DO NOT WANT THAT IN MY LIFE.

To me, the key is recognising and ABSORBING in your soul that this person - these people - are not worthy of you. If your exn's OW is nice to your daughter, that is a good thing. THe OW Narc treats my daughter just as you would expect....she sleeps over at his house when my daughter is there even though it is prohibited in our PP, they still do it. She has been asked multiple times to let daughter and her dad have time alone, never happens. She herself has/does parade a string of lovers in front of her own daughters. Why would I expect my daughter to be treated better than her own? She is not a role model to them, and so she certainly won't with mine.

I know this all "helps" me get over it. I'm focused on only what I CAN CONTROL - me and my influence on her. THEY are scum, they are not worthy.

FOCUS ON YOUR OWN LIFE. Be grateful you are OUT. It makes no difference if they are together 50 years or 5 is irrelevant. SHE (your OW) may put up with his BS forever...but that does not mean they have a great relationship.

July 8, 2012 - 5:47pm (Reply to #7)


Your situation is harsh to say the least. My daughter is only 5 and was 4 when it happened so she doesn't understand really what all if this is about. Only that she misses her family being together and thinks if ow leaves then mommy can come back. Ow is "nice" but what else could she be if she wants daddy. She has slept over since day one I left and my daughter has walked in on ow in her underwear and daddy in a towel. Nice. So I believe this ow is just as selfish and daddy may love his daughter yes, but he is selfish as well. It is him first and ow is such great supply he won't give daughter one on one time either. That's daddy doing that though not ow. Ge needs her there for him to have the sense of he is still this great man with an even better and improved family life. Sick!!
I get what you are saying though if I really look at them and how these people ARE I won't miss him so much as despise him enough to not want anymore. Maybe so. I'm thinking he can't do much more to me at this point though and thinking I'd be moving on with those thoughts now and I do at times, but the feeling of what should have been could of been and how he may have it all with ow still rules me.
Thank you for sharing your story and I fully see how it was and is incredibly difficult but you see it" and them for what they are. I can't or haven't been able to see this yet. I see ow as the answer to his sickness where I failed.

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