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Not every person
knighty2035
Member since:
1 year 11 weeks
1 year 11 weeks
Last activity:
12 weeks 2 days
12 weeks 2 days
Not every person
Posted May 17, 2012 - 8:20am
Not every person who rejects us or is a douche is a NARC. I think we have to be careful when labeling people. I am here because my stbx truly does have NPD, as diagnosed our therapist. It is an untreatable illness... where as being a simple lying cheating douche-bag is simply an undesirable character trait. I feel sorry for my stbx... as there is no real hope for change because he doesn't have enough introspect to really look in his own mirror instead of borrowing his personality from others. I have read many many posts on here... and just because someone turns out to be not quite what they portrayed or you thought they were... does not mean they are really NPD. Some may have a lot of narcisistic traits... and I think most men have more traits of narcisism than women... but not necessarily a true personality DISORDER.
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What is the point of this post?
May 17, 2012 - 11:18am — goldieAre you talking about yourself labeling.
Who thinks that people who are not Narcs are narcs? I don't. I can tell the difference.
If someone lie's to you, cheats on you, and is a basic selfish person. Why would you want to be with them anyway. What would be the point?
I have been on here for 2 years and have not seen anyone here lableling Narcs who were not narcs.
So help me to understand what you are talking about.
Thank you,
Goldie
I simply think
May 17, 2012 - 10:46am — knighty2035it's important that although NPD's are out there, and it's real... we can not simply label the last person or the next person as such. We are all fragile from our experiences so we have to be careful not to see one or two traits and immediately suggest they are NPD. And I'm certainly not advocating that we brush over red flags. If you see a deal breaker... break the deal. We are under no obligation to keep trying... but neither are they. Perhaps a future date may just be a poor match for us. I can honestly say that my stbxNPD is the first I've ever had an experience with. I've previously experienced and alcoholic...but he was NOT NPD. My stbxNPD... i think he really would like to be the person he thinks he is, the person he wanted me to see him as. He simply isn't cognizent enough to realize he borrows his personality traits and has failed to develop his real self. He knows there is something wrong with him, he knows he has a negative view of life, people, jobs, and experiences... he just doesn't realize he actually has a negative view of himself and that his disorder causes him to be demoralizing and abusive to others. The ego won't allow the truth to come in. But just because I had 16 years of NPD ... doesn't mean every creepy douche bag I come into contact or previously had contact with fits into the NPD box. I feel sorry for my stbxNPD.. but that sure doesn't mean I want another ride on the crazy train. He will have to ride on his own.. or sucker another to ride with him. And trust me... I am not trying to diminish anyone elses experiences. Just saying that sometimes a creepy cheating shady douche is just a douche.
knighty
May 17, 2012 - 11:14am — UsedI still do not see the point of first post or this post....
absolutly no point to any of this....
all its done is dismiss and minimise anyone on here who has not been with EXS as long as you were with your ex..
Thomas Sheridan talks about this in his book.
May 17, 2012 - 10:43am — abrevaI agree with you
and -
I don't think it actually matters if I am wrong about the man I now refer to as EXNH-Psychopath. I treat him like a Psychopath, and my life works better. By treating him like he was a normal person, I was trapped in a continual cycle of abuse.
I have started putting the Family Member (who is now a pawn for the psychopath) in the category of N/P -- maybe FM isn't an N or a P, but FM has behaved in abusive ways and I want freedom from that.
A Rose by any other name . . .
May 17, 2012 - 10:31am — PortiaI don't think it is important that the N be "formally" diagnosed. What is important is that WE care enough to seek solutions to problems and care enough about our own safety and sanity to protect ourselves from ALL abusers, whether they are full blown NPD or merely jerks. My N's will never be formally diagnosed, because they will not go to therapy (they are perfect, don't you know) and even if they did they would only lie and try to charm the therapist. What is important to me was that "lightbulb moment" when I could finally relax and know I had found the answer. I have enough self doubt to be critical of my own actions, but I knew I did not deserve to be treated the way I have been treated. I could not understand why anyone would act the way N's act. Accepting that they will always be that way, they choose to be that way, and they will never change was a wonderful epiphany. I am liberated because I know I did not cause it, and I cannot do anything to help cure it. I am not saying I am without fault -- I am saying I am NOT responsible for the crazy actions and destructive behaviors that an N does - to me, or to anyone else! Oh sweet freedom !!!
knighty
May 17, 2012 - 10:21am — UsedWhat diffrence does it make? what they are they bought us all here, and here is where we will all hopefully heal......
We all bear SCARS....I was with exnh for 31 years, but it doesnt make someone on here LESS HURT OR IMPORTANT...cos they were with someone less time than me....
I find this post pretty NEGATIVE.....
Everyone's pain is everyone's pain they are no less important b/c they may have been with a douchebag and not a narc or any other LABEL...
I must say..........
May 17, 2012 - 8:48am — Layla....my abuser was diagnosed as well. He is narcissist primary and antisocial secondary disorders and is a violent abuser. I must say, a LOT of people's abusers on this site sound like mine on the narc side, and joybfla and Goldies specifically sound like mine on the antisocial side........
I am not a doctor or a Mod, but you must remember, MOST PDs are never officially diagnosed because you see, they don't think there is anything wrong with themselves. It's everyone else that has the problem, according to them.
If you can honestly check off MOST of the boxes on a PD checklist as being a fair assessment of traits in your abuser, chances are they are suffering from the affliction at some place on the spectrum. Some are worse than others because narcissism falls on a continuum.
Please also remember, if you are referring to posts of cheating and OW and "he dumped me for OW" etc....the personality types MOST likely to be cheaters are Cluster B personalities and I think most people find their way here because they just KNOW something out of the ordinary is inherently wrong with the person they were in relationship with.
love~ Layla
Excellent Layla Hunter
May 17, 2012 - 11:01am — HunterExcellent Layla
Hunter
Layla I couldn't agree more
May 17, 2012 - 9:38am — LoserFreeLayla I couldn't agree more with your reply!!
Getting my ExN to be diagnosed would have been impossible because he doesn't think it's him...but everyone else. If I even suggested that he get help he would have laughed in my face before giving me the ST.
What you said about the PD checklist is exactly what I did when I just couldn't figure out his bizarre behavior anymore. I knew in my gut something was so way off with him. I found a Narcissist website and went through the 20 listed signs of NPD. I ended up strongly checking off 18 of those boxes.
There is NO DOUBT in my mind that he is anything other than Disordered!! Plus everything I have read now in Lisa's book, blogs, and other posts only confirms what I know to be true!
XOXO
Loserfree
Layla and LoserFree
May 17, 2012 - 10:00am — Lucky EscapeHere, here........totally agree with both of you.
Mine also would never come to counselling with me, but my therapist was the one who mentioned narcissist characteristics and gave me details of books etc to read. Without meeting him herself, she certainly would not have been able to confirm that he had a full on NPD. However, being an educated, intelligent and well-read person, I bothered to do that research myself. I am now half way thru Dr Sam V's book and have researched for hours - not just on narcissism, but also on various other P disorders.
I am fairly sure that none of us would be on this forum if we didn't feel that we were abused and those abusers were narcissistic, pyscopathic, disordered, abusive, manipulative etc.
I have been in other relationships where men have cheated - they are generally jocks, harmless and non-abusive, not manipulative - I think I can tell the difference btw lying, cheating jocks and those capable of abusive and damaging mental, emotial and potentially physical cruelty.
Yes, there is a spectrum to these characteristics and the disordered can behave in many different ways - however, the thing that is real is the way we were ALL made to feel, and that in my opinion deserves respect, compassion and understanding, no matter what and no matter who feels they may have a worse N than the next person.
LE I too have been with
May 17, 2012 - 10:13am — LoserFreeLE I too have been with cheaters and I wrote them off for exactly that reason. Because they were lying, cheating assholes. Nothing more and nothing less. They weren't damaging to me emotionally or mentally like my exN. I didn't leave the cheating relationship and curl up in a fetal position feeling like I have been raped to the point of no return.
We are here because our gut has been telling us for so long that something isn't right with them. So when we look up Narcissism it's a light bulb moment and things start to make total sense with their bizarre behavior. At least that's how it was for me.
XOXO
Loserfree
Sorry
May 17, 2012 - 10:11am — knighty2035Some of us have indeed been in a long term relationship with a true NPD person and have the scars, pain and damage like PTSD. Some may be involved with someone who might be more BPD... but not every person who dated a douche-bag for 3 months has had a true PD experience. Some people truly just ran into a shitty person. My point is there are douche bags and there are NARCS. NPD's have a real disorder... and are douche-bags... but not all douche-bags are NARCS.
Knighty I totally get your
May 17, 2012 - 10:28am — BtrflyGrlKnighty I totally get your point. But it feel like you are minimizing what other people are going through. You have no way to tell if they had a real Narc experience or not. People are trying to heal and it is confusing enough. Why put more doubt in their head by having them ask themselves (again) maybe mine wasn't a real Narc. That will just lead them to try again, and if they do, what if they find out how sick the bastard really is? I just don't think it's fair. We all know there is a difference but I thiink you are introducing doubt. Those that didn't have a real PD experience will probably fall off the site sooner than later, cause it will be easier for them to move on. And good for them! I hope for many of us that is that it's a case of a simple broken heart from dating a jerk. But your comment isn't worth the risk for those that are really involved with a PD.
BtrflyGrl what an excellent
May 17, 2012 - 10:35am — LoserFreeBtrflyGrl what an excellent point you brought up about creating doubt in a member that is so confused. And then they go back and give it another go at it only to be abused again.
What an awful thought.
You are totally correct that if they aren't Narcs then they will heal faster and move on. No harm done to anyone. A win-win situation regardless.
Thanks for your insight...
Loserfree
I have NO doubt the ex is a
May 18, 2012 - 2:27am — bluegirlI have NO doubt the ex is a narcissist. What I'm having a problem with is meeting new people and perhaps deciding too quickly they might be a narcissist without really getting to know them. I'm definitely skittish about it.