He Tries to Change?!

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#1 Jul 22 - 11AM

Anonymous (not verified)

He Tries to Change?!

I can't wrap my head around all the work my N has done to change. A birthday present, some chores around the house, contributing to groceries, admitting he is a jerk and has treated me horribly, going to Sex Addicts Anonymous, deleting his ex from his phone (but keeping her on facebook, where I'm blocked), and generally trying to be more considerate. In general, the sort of things a normal man would not resent.

Why is he doing all this work? Is it because I stopped providing my time and money? Stopped doing his laundry? Took back my keys? No longer filled my cupboards just to watch him eat all my food? Put printed information about the narcissist/codependent relationship on the wall? Asked him to leave when the verbal abuse was too obvious to ignore?

We were together off and on for one and a half years, then I had my first successful attempt at NC -- and he came crawling back and for the past six months he's admitted to a lot of his wrongs, and worked on being nicer to me. He resents not having total control, and he still goes off about how flawed I am on a regular basis.

Yesterday he insisted on coming over because "we're in a relationship and I need you." Then when I was cold, he ranted and called me names and put me down for not being committed to the relationship, and not emotionally here. He was right...I have made efforts to disconnect myself a little at a time...less sex, less time together, not returning calls, less support, no presents, no favors, less approval, less shutting my mouth to keep the peace.

He seems pretty uncomfortable with the way I've changed, and how I'm going back to school instead of planning to follow him when he has to move to a different city in a month. Not that he invited me, but he was offended I didn't rearrange my life and beg to join him.

I'm thinking he knew he didn't have enough time to find someone new, brainwash her, and then drain her financially -- because he's got some money deadlines coming up soon. I have tightened my wallet and told him I won't do for him what he can do for himself, so maybe he just thought it was a temporary boundary?

There was definitely some desperation going on yesterday when I told him I didn't want to be his girlfriend anymore. He ended up knocking over my computer and pushing me to the ground. That was the third physical attack in two years, and it seems to happen when I am unmistakably standing up for myself.

Is it possible for a Narc to honestly attempt change? I suspect he hasn't really changed one bit -- just hides his ugliness better to keep me around. But why all the effort?

#2 Jul 30 - 10AM

Sunafterrain

Cog/Dis

I wanted to call this to your attention and I hope its helpful. you say he's being nice and that he's trying to change, yet he calls you names, pushes you down.....he hasn't changed AT ALL. Go with your gut. It's clear that you know what's going on, when you doubt or think he's "changed" simply because he's intermittently "nice", that's the cog/dis acting up. This guy is a TOTAL douche bag. When you STOP giving him what he wants (obviously money here), they get pissed off. You're thinking he's disordered is correct. I truly hope you will be strong enough to kick the asshole to the curb before his "niceties" allow you to open your wallet and your heart. What a DOUCHE!

#3 Jul 22 - 6PM

happysoon

they do as little as possible

they do as little as possible to keep you around. Towards the end of my relationship I told him I would do nothing since I did just about everything the first two years...I told him he had to come to my house...I'm a 40yr old woman and do not want to be sleeping over a 37yr old boys home that belongs to his daddy.... he came to my house tuesdays and one night each weekend for 3 weeks, this was nothing compared to what i did but he expected praise and got angry with me because he was doing "everything" I said 3 weeks doesnt compare to 2yrs...he couldnt even pick up the phone to call me most of the time...such assholes

#4 Jul 22 - 6PM

ruby01 (not verified)

I think the truth is

the effort he is putting into getting you back is much less than having to find new supply and start all over again.

#5 Jul 22 - 6PM (Reply to #23)

strongblackcoffee

I agree with Ruby

100% Too lazy to find new supply. Sorry :-( But the fact that he ERUPTED as I have come to call it when my xN does that, is a MAJOR CLUE that he has not changed. He is incapable of any of the feelings or actions he TELLS you he is doing. Keeping you blocked from FB is a serious RED FLAG for me. They love their technology to maintain these many lies, I mean lives. Hugs, coffee

#6 Jul 22 - 8PM (Reply to #24)

birdie (not verified)

Too lazy to find new supply sounds about right

The man is too lazy to do anything...a full-time job, housework, etc. Well, except for in bed. He said he was in a relationship with ONLY me these past six months, and went on and on about being fully committed this time, and was at my house constantly. I never really regained any sort of trust in him, and every time he got pissed at my suspicions, I'd just point out his facebook page and all the honeys on it. He never did figure out how I was seeing his friends list. He must be in a panic. He's got lots of fling potential, and plenty of interaction with other females to feed his ego, but they're all young and broke. I'm fairly certain his ex/not-ex ran her cards to the max and has got nothing left for him. So...no one to bail him out of his latest financial mess. He's not going to be able to make rent here in town or pay for a new place at his new school because of his laziness. I'm pretty sure he was priming me to do that in the last few days. And I didn't take the bait. I stayed focused on my own plan, and it felt really great. Would it be too much to ask that he accidentally find this website? Oh, no, he's too lazy! I think I just got the big picture without feeling too wounded ;) Good riddance. I just saved myself the agony of fighting off more money manipulation, and freed up a lot of time. Everyone, please wish him financial wellness so he MOVES like he planned. Cuz this town ain't big enough for the both of us. Thank you all, for confirming my suspicion that all that effort to change was just one big manipulative act to use me. I didn't buy in this time, but sure was curious about why he put in so much time arguing and "fighting" for our relationship.

#7 Jul 22 - 2PM

Done sourcing

Effort, How much effort to

Effort, How much effort to physically attack you? First time shame on him. Now you know better. Standing up for yourself gets you attacked. Either stop standing up for yourself....hmmm....or get honest with yourself and let him go. We sure spend alot of time in their heads figuring out what they are thinking, and what their actions mean. I want to tell you...his action of throwing you down means he is violent...and your letting him continue to do it tells him it is ok with you. Not just the narc's actions speak louder than words. At this point telling him its not ok is a waste of breath, because your actions told him otherwise. Words aren't change, words are what narcs use to manipulate us. You say yesterday he insisted on coming over...the truth is you let him come over when he asked if he could. The truth will set you free, when you are ready to stop being his emotional and physical punching bag. We here on the site know you are worth much more than this assclown will ever be abe to offer you...Here's hoping you take our word for it and go nc now. He doesn't get an explanation, that continues the drama and the dance of death your two are doing. You need to find another way of resolving this conflict inside of you that lets him walk all over you....he is not the answer to your problems, but he isn't your problem anymore either. The problem is in you, and in your inability to become willing to let him go right now. Now is the best time to cut all ties, right now. No more excuses.... These harsh remarks come from my experience...My narc was a woman, I am a man...but the dynamic and toxicity was the same, I was sick too....nc is the path forward...it doesn't get much worse than physical abuse, but the physical abuse will get worse and more frequent. Be blessed and strong! ds

#8 Jul 22 - 3PM (Reply to #21)

birdie (not verified)

Done sourcing

Second time shame on me? It was actually the third, and I feel no shame. Just courage, wisdom, and pride in my choice to show him the door, with the 9 and the 1 and the 1 dialed and ready to send. Not an easy task for a female raised in an environment where men hit women and children. He didn't ask to come over. He said he'd like to, and I said I didn't want him to. Last time I went NC for six months, despite him showing up day and night, until I put up a no trespassing sign. But I was WEAK, and could hear him crying, and a woman is supposed to be compassionate, right? Not. any. more. I am NC, I assure you. His attack followed the words "I don't want to be your girlfriend anymore." He'll be gone in 30 days, so if he isn't the problem, and the problem is in me, and in my inability to become willing to let him go right now, then I would be packing to move with him right now. Which I'm not.

#9 Jul 22 - 2PM

Better than ever

Every single time we broke

Every single time we broke up, the same thing happened.....he would miss me, cry a bit, promise to change and would "try" really hard for 2 months, slip the mask for the next two months, and reveal the true narc for the last two.....so,six months later we would be done again....

#10 Jul 22 - 1PM

Reddley

Maybe he just feels he's

Maybe he just feels he's invested too much into you already to allow you to go without one last great attempt at keeping you there. Believe me when I tell you... You can't help someone who doesn't want help or doesn't believe they need help. It's like forcing a drunk into AA. If they aren't ready to accept there is a problem, AA isn't going to help them. N's do not think they have a problem... everyone else does. Violence only escalates... no matter how much they apologize. It seems to be that once you forgive someone for cheating or hitting you... they know you'll forgive again. It's a free for all. This doesn't apply to just N's.

#11 Jul 22 - 1PM

twisted

"Then when I was cold, he

"Then when I was cold, he ranted and called me names and put me down for not being committed to the relationship, and not emotionally here." Ha! Oh, the irony. Narc's absolutely DO NOT learn by a taste of thier own medicine. He is still showing you his narc personality. What you are describing isn't changing - what you are describing are the classic offerings of bread crumbs to convince you to love him again. This is very typical when he feels you slipping out of his control, and it will very likely stop once he has you again. All the effort? He bought you a birthday present and helped clean up? That's called being an adult. Don't forget they try to bribe you with very small offerings and expect to be treated like a king for doing the bare minimum. But because you are so used to getting squat, suddenly chipping in for groceries makes him look like Superman.

#12 Jul 22 - 1PM

Hunter

He can try, but I believe

He can try, but I believe that he is mirroring, it's also manipulation to suck you in! Ok so he tries, for how long? It it woth it to you to ride the Rollercoaster? Only you know the answer! Honey, he can't change, do you think all the information out there is BS? Seems to me that it would be a waste of time and money to publish false truths! Again these are choices YOU need to make! Is it easy? nope ! typically anything worthwhile requires work! Hunter

#13 Jul 22 - 12PM

spinning

Birdie, dearheart, fly away

from this person as fast as you can. I could have written this almost word for word and wonder if we're not talking about the same disordered individual. When I discovered what he was and what I was dealing with (thanks to this site) I knew I had to help myself and STOP the relationship or I would be destroyed. Financially, mentally, spiritually, physically. Damage was compounding daily. You sound very strong and determined. You have done NC and he hoovered. This happened to me, too. Unfortunately I was too weak to fight his "attempts to change" and ended up in another year of HELL that included physical incidences like you describe and put me in fear for my life and my safety. They do not like it at all when you start to withdraw supply. And since he knew exactly what was going on, he formulated a most brutal D & D that was designed to take me down and leave me 'spinning.' And it almost, almost worked. Spare yourself this. You already know he's outta here in a month. Quit seeing him altogether. Get it over with now on your terms. If you keep interacting he's going to amp it up and you will see a craziness like nothing you've ever imagined. Birdie, I think you know everything you need to know about this guy. I am proud of you for closing your wallet, your cupboards and your heart and hopefully you won't give him your body any more either. Nothing good will come of it for you. You are on your way to ridding yourself of huge dead weight. You will be so happy when you did. I'm 8.5 months out, total NC (he disappeared, changed his phone number, left the area after a six year so-called relationship with me all while my dad was dying...what a guy!!) and I'm here to tell you my life is better than I COULD HAVE EVER DREAMED. Amazing things are happening to me. I now look at his attempt to destroy me as the BEST thing that ever happened to me. Spare yourself months of anguish and confusion. If possible, go NC now. This guy's got nothing for you and if he's violent (tossing computer, knocking you down), THAT IS NOT ACCEPTABLE IN YOUR WORLD AND IS REASON ENOUGH TO SHOW HIM THE DOOR. Hugs and good vibes to you birdie for continued strength and clarity from (not) spinning. NO LONGER AN OPTION. THE SICK FREAK IS BACK IN A SIDESHOW WHERE HE BELONGS AND NOT IN MY LIFE!!!

spinning

#14 Jul 22 - 1PM (Reply to #13)

birdie (not verified)

spinning

I wanted to be named "spinning" because that's what I did for a year and a half while he did his like-clockwork-D&D-stuff. But I picked "birdie" because birds represent freedom. And spinning, we are not talking about the same individual, but for a second there, I thought you were his ex/not-ex. That would be embarrassing! Either way, I'm so sorry for how your ex treated you. I'm happy you're happy now. Getting out has been a tough process. I've been on a roller coaster for two years, and with each breakup, I learned something, read something, and even though I kept going back, I put less into the relationship. It took me a while to figure out he was a narc, and a little while longer to accept that he was like every other narc. I know it's normal to go back, I know it isn't logical...and yet a lot of us do for years, so why not forgive myself, and be glad I grew some wisdom and boundaries for the first time in my life?! It's the only real gift I received in this relationship, and it's a good one. Sometimes I want stuff back: time, dignity, all those thousands, family relationships, friends, etc., but I'm pretty sure it took a man this evil to help me grow a set. It's been one abusive relationship after another since my teens, and the home I was raised in was hellish on a good day. I believe you 100% that your life is better than you ever could have dreamed. Just unloading him for the final time, knowing he's going to be gone from my city and I won't have to see him...I feel so much lighter, and am so excited to be going back to school and maybe even making some friends that know nothing about the relationship. I get a fresh start as a stronger person. I am a little worried he'll go file a report with the police. He put in a complaint once -- all I did was text him back when he was texting me -- but he likes to cover himself legally. I came really close to calling 911 yesterday, so he's going to be looking to protect himself. I guess I'll just wait, and hope he is worried about provoking me into causing him legal trouble in return. Thank you for the encouragement. I made a 30-day countdown calendar, and at the top of each day's work is NC. But just to be on the safe side, I'm changing my phone number ;)

#15 Jul 22 - 1PM (Reply to #14)

spinning

birdie, love your thoughtful

name as now I always have to update my 'signer' because I refuse to spin ever again. It is amazing, isn't it. The more you discover, go through, experience until all the lights go on and then you know you're done with the dance. I want to add that all the while he's pretending to treat you better and do things you wish he is secretly resenting you for this. You probably already know that. When the disordered one I was involved with brutally D & D'd me he actually told a mutual friend that he had to do it because he was "catering to my every need and it wasn't enough!" WTF??? Catering to my "every need" was stopping at my house while I was staying at my parents to take care of my animals and eat my food. Catering to my "every need" was giving me silent treatment because I could no longer spend every waking moment revolving my life around him. "Catering to my every need" was showing up only an hour late instead of the usual two or three when I needed his help. "Catering to my every need" was constantly calling me, asking me how I was feeling, how things were going, was I on my way home, etc. etc. a thousand controlling times a day! YUCK!!!! Wow, was that a rant or what. I'm just sharing because THEY DON'T CHANGE. THEY PRETEND FOR A WHILE TO TRY TO SECURE YOUR SUPPLY. That's it. The minute you re-write the script the devil reveals himself and it's all YOUR fault. Whatever. I'm so very glad it's out of my life. I agree with you 100 percent. I now believe this person was brought into my life (maybe I even called it into my life) to finally FORCE me to deal with deep seated issues of low self-esteem, insecurity, perfectionism, self-worth, etc. It's amazing what is happening now that I understand this! Birdie, I am excited for you and your new NARC FREE LIFE! Hang in and post here. We're all here for you. Most sincerely, (not) spinning. NEVER EVER AGAIN. THE SICK FREAK IS DEAD. NEVER REALLY EXISTED IN THE FIRST PLACE.

spinning

#16 Jul 22 - 2PM (Reply to #15)

birdie (not verified)

(not) spinning...you are brilliant!

I'm following your lead, for sure! Inspiring, that's what you are! Just hearing you say "all the while he's pretending to treat you better and do things you wish he is secretly resenting you for this" reassured me in that exact suspicion. I didn't ask for much. In fact, all I asked was for him to be less abusive. I actually would stop him from doing anything for me, and even told him I would rather he didn't, because the ensuing resentment and punishment wasn't worth it to me. When I realized how much he resented having to treat me like a human, it made it almost funny to see him squirm every time he did anything for me. He'd ask how my day went, and was in agony if I talked about it...he tuned out everything. I knew, but tortured him anyway. Babble babble babble...it was so hard for him not to outright smack me sometimes. "giving me silent treatment because I could no longer spend every waking moment revolving my life around him"... I went through the same thing. I was run ragged revolving everything around his needs, to the point where I started to look ragged, which of course, he resented. Now he's due for some really hard times, and not taking care of him is like a vacation of sorts.

#17 Jul 22 - 12PM

BadaBing

all talk

Hey Birdie I think so much of it is all talk with them! Wow good FOR YOU taking control of your life and what you want and not following also GREAT FOR YOU on your " efforts to disconnect myself a little at a time...less sex, less time together, not returning calls, less support, no presents, no favors, less approval, less shutting my mouth to keep the peace." it is hard to do this but you seem to be doing just fine! Is Sex Addicts like AA? My EX cheated on me ( i walked in on them together on our sofa!) and I wonder if he may also be a sex addict? hope you hang in there birdie!

#18 Jul 22 - 1PM (Reply to #11)

birdie (not verified)

BadaBing

Thanks for the encouragement. It's easy to put up a stone wall, but I think my heart is going to be numb for a long long time. It's just dead right now, but I'm hopeful I got most of the mourning stage done while still in the relationship. That sure would be nice! A "somatic" narcissist can't keep his pants on. Everything is about sex, how he looks, his muscles, how he can get women and men to look and admire. Mine was obsessed with sex, and resentful I didn't really want him. Although he was beautiful, I lost attraction for him because my heart was tied to my lady parts. It was confusing to go from hot to not. He moved into the degrading stuff despite my resistance, which seems to fit the profile. Sex Addicts Anonymous (SAA) or Sex and Love Addicts Anonymous (SLAA) is for people who can't get enough, for various emotional reasons. It's like AA, with steps. He came back from the first meeting and said the work is way harder than AA. I can't believe you walked in on him cheating. I can't imagine the shock. I caught mine on a date yesterday. In the beginning of the relationship, he once couldn't get me out fast enough, and his ex/not-ex showed up for their appointment, but he had plenty of lies to cover that one, and never made the mistake again! It's funny in hindsight, but at the time, is sure is humiliating, huh?

#19 Jul 22 - 11AM

Joy2me

Their "attempt to change" can be confusing...

Their attempt to change can be confusing, very confusing. My ex NPD husband did the samething. We separated for two years because of his second affair, it was during this time that I learned of his disorder. During this time he embraced church, got involved, kept saying how much he wanted our marriage to work, started doing the things around the house that he should have always been doing, controlled his temper (so it appeared). But for two years I watched and watched, and many times felt guilty for not trusting this "change" but I continued to watch. During this two years we fought over the affair other affiars before that one, other lies over and over and over. Since I could not "prove" a lot of things he just kept lying. I learned really quick unless I had concrete proof of something he did he would just lie and manipulate the facts. Very confusing time for me...but I started reading on NPD and I started to see him more clearly. On June 2 2010 we had an argument and he attacked me physically. At that point I knew everything I had been feeling about his "attempts at changing" were all a lie. I filed for divorce in July and was out there by the end of the month. I still questioned myself for a long time afterwards wondering had he really tried to change? But God is good, while I was torturing myself with that thought the husband of the woman he had the last affair contacted me. Though him I found out that the entire two years that we were separated he was still contacting his affair partner. He had started another relationship in April or May of 2010. All the while begging and begging me to forgive and that he was a "changed man" sometimes accusing me of not wanting to see the change! My conclusion, the only pretend to change or half heartedly attempt to change to fool us, maybe in their distorted way of thinking they are truly trying to change but the efforts to change are only good until they find another NS that they don't have to work so hard for. Within 2 months of me and the kids leaving he moved in an entire new family in the house he had shared with us? Go figure.

#20 Jul 22 - 12PM (Reply to #9)

birdie (not verified)

uncovering all the affairs...Joy2me you're so right

Yes, Joy2me, exactly what I was thinking: "only pretend to change or half heartedly attempt to change to fool us, maybe in their distorted way of thinking they are truly trying to change but the efforts to change are only good until they find another NS that they don't have to work so hard for." He hated all my disapproval, and I bet he's looking forward to moving forward on one of his new marks who won't be so critical of his lies. He became irate if criticized. My exNarc left his journal out. Nuff said. Not only was he seeing the woman he dumped me for, for the ENTIRE time we were together, but he was having flings in addition, thereby cheating on his "ex" and me at the same time. He trash-talked all of us. I will never forget the day we went to his place after his birthday dinner, and she had left a cake on his step. Duh. I just ate the cake, knowing it was from her. Even with a ton of evidence, like tea cups with lipstick, underwear that wasn't mine, etc., I just accepted his lies and stowed the hurt. I studied his behaviors enough to know when he lied. I kind of want to contact his ex (who was never his ex), but I figure if every N pulls the same garbage, I don't really have to do any more thinking or questioning or hunting for answers.

#21 Jul 22 - 11AM

Used

THE DESPERATION HE SHOWED WAS

THE DESPERATION HE SHOWED WAS B/C YOU SAID THE R/S WAS OVER...SO HE HAD DONE 6MNTHS WORK FOR NOTHING...SO THE REAL HIM WAS BACK.

#22 Jul 22 - 11AM

Used

HE PUSHED YOU TO THE

HE PUSHED YOU TO THE GROUND...KNOCKED YOUR COMPUTER...AND YOU ARE SAYING HE HAS CHANGED? A FEW CHORES IS CHILDS PLAY...

#23 Jul 22 - 11AM (Reply to #2)

birdie (not verified)

then why all the effort?

No, obviously he hasn't changed if he does stuff like that. I am just curious as to why he put in six solid months of kissing my behind before that incident. It just doesn't make sense for such a selfish lazy man to make such effort.

#24 Jul 22 - 11AM (Reply to #3)

jen79

birdie

you still try to understand something with your sane mind, that is insane. You wont ever get this, not with your heart, maybe with your intellect though. But dont even try to get this. He did this, cause he wanted control back. Maybe he wasnt even aware of. They have no souls, they just do to what they need to do. Dont try to make sense out of it. I have glimpses now of their darkness, I can feel it somethimes in my heart why they do the things they do, but we cannot sustain that feeling for long, cause its too dark there. And my health is more important to me, than understanding the devil to its detail.

#25 Jul 22 - 2PM (Reply to #6)

BadaBing

so true Jen70

our rational minds cannot make sense of this stuff it is a good question - why all the effort? Birdie you are his supply, maybe he has affairs and side affairs but You were Primary NS. You were the most stable source of supply , so he may of been fearful of losing his only quality supply available at that time. ? we can't figure this stuff out NC is what we need

#26 Jul 22 - 11AM (Reply to #4)

birdie (not verified)

yes, time to focus on my own health!

Good point -- time to put all that brain activity towards my own happiness and health. I don't think I could ever figure him out, and am thankful I am less confused now than ever before, and definitely a stronger person.

#27 Jul 22 - 11AM (Reply to #5)

jen79

birdie

exactly, focus on you and your health, and how happiness, serenity, and contentment feels like. And train yourself to sustain those feelings in your heart. You cannot solve it, cause its not your conflict, its his. Cause trying to get them, to understand it with our hearts, oh boy, this makes us sick!

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