I experienced realization today that really scared me

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#1 Apr 12 - 3AM

neverlookback

I experienced realization today that really scared me

I am following up on the last topic I posted, Recovering from a predator. NC is great but the longer I remain NC sometimes it seems the more shock I experience. After I read this article it was EVERYTHING that was used on me by this man. EVERY SINGLE ploy, scheme, and technique. I dont know why I feel a wave of shock I have known what he was for a long long time, and the sad part, I think the last year he KNEW I knew what his game was and he was trying to brainwash me into accepting what he was. He truly wanted to make me as sick as he was, and I see that now that I cut him out of my life. This has given me a totally new perspective of this man and what he IS, and how he LIVES.

His charm was the charm of a highly skilled psychopath - I often wonder if they KNOW these specific techniques like they describe in the books or are the just instinctively good at it because of their disorder? It is written that they NEVER learn from their mistakes, I question that - I think they become skilled by trial and error, what worked on one victim may not work on another, so as they move from one victim to the next, maybe they learn from their mistakes in the past that caused that victim to leave. I think they improve their act by trial and error. It was a long long time before he took his mask off, he really made sure he had secured my deep love and trust before he tightened the screws so to speak, and yet even when his mask fell he still knew he had to keep me thinking I was special to him, he always had the ability to make me feel as if I was special, even thru all the abuse.

I can read topics you post and KNOW in a minute who is still under their spell, and in their sphere of influence, I can hear just a glimmer of hope that you think they can love, or love the other woman or when they come back hoovering your heart wants to believe them but your mind tells you differently. To this day I wish I had meant SOMETHING - ANYTHING to him in any small way, but I know now I NEVER DID. I am learning to accept that with each passing day, because I truly understand what I was involved with. We are all in different stages of discovery and recovery and I am by no means completely healed, but with each passing day of him OUT OF MY LIFE I am learning to accept what he was, and will ALWAYS BE. I was conned by a psychopath there is no simpler way to put it. They CANT LOVE, nor do they ever truly love anybody they are with and that is all I need to know. Closure can be as simple as knowing that and moving on to how I want to be loved.

#2 Apr 14 - 6AM

fear for my sanity

I like your name, Never look Back

It is when we look back and realize all the subtle ways in which we were conned, that we experience the shock of it all again. It is good to be aware of the N's ploys because we hopefully will recognize them in anyone else who tries to do the same to us. Hopefully we will reach a point when we don't look back anymore. Replaying situations in my mind was threatening to drive me crazy with confusion. I don't know what sinister game he was playing or why he chose to befriend me but I welcomed him into my family and my home and my husband and kids met him on several occasions. I always told my husband when I was meeting him (we used to go to art exhibitions together and on walks as we are both interested in photography). There was never any physical contact between us at all, except a hug 'hello' and 'goodbye'. My husband has since said that he thought N was in love with me, so good were his acting skills! I haven't told my husband about the emotional hold N had on me because I feel so guilty about it even though I understand better now about how I was manipulated into believing N was in love with me. My husband is a good man but is a workoholic and has never made it a priority to spend time with me which has inevitably left me with low self-esteem. I have never sought out relationships outside of my marriage though and it was a huge shock to me that I should start to have feelings for someone else.Turns out, N had to establish a really close friendship with me in order to make his ex-girlfriend (who had been his primary source of supply) jealous. He didn't do this with sex because that would have probably made her turn her back on him for good. Instead, he played a different game, using all the things we had in common (a love of art, music, philosophy etc)to make her feel insecure, like she didn't measure up to me on an intellectual level. I only met her twice but on both these occasions he made a point of hugging me more than usual in front of her when saying goodbye which made me feel very uncomfortable as I was aware that she still had feelings for him. I like to think that if he had ever wanted sex I would have been strong enough to refuse but the emotional involvement still makes me feel so guilty.At times I still feel very angry and want to contact him to give him a piece of my mind and to lay the whole thing to rest. But as you said, closure can be as simple as just knowing that you were conned by someone who is incapable of love and moving on to how you want to be loved. You sound like you're on a good path to recovery and I hope to be there soon too. Three days ago before I joined this forum, I was desperate but I am in a much better place now thanks to all the support I have received here and posts such as yours. Thank you.

#3 Apr 14 - 8AM (Reply to #12)

neverlookback

funny

you should mention your husband thinking he was in love with you, because at my mothers funeral (he was there of course) my husband said who is that man, he keeps staring at you has not taken his eyes off you the ENTIRE visitation, he looks creepy. I never thought much of that comment, now when I think back PREDATOR comes to mind, I told him oh he is my cousin I havent seen him for 23 years, even my own children said Mom he keeps looking at you. You are very fortunate you never got intimately involved with this man, they really get ya when you get physically addicted to them, however, they have sooo many sexual issues that the mask also comes off in the sex department as well, ED kicks in and you begin to wonder why this person cant get aroused. You saw him for what he was, and how they plan and calculate and plot to get their victims. Its really very sick and quite frankly the more I am nc the creepier he is to me. Just goes to show you, ANY and ALL contact with them is very very damaging - Martha Stout is right, DONT EVEN BORROW A CUP OF SUGAR FROM THEM IF YOU ARE THEIR NEIGHBOR. Yes I am in a better place but his memories HAUNT ME, and I MEAN HAUNT ME, One day he will completely fade from my mind it just takes time, I honestly think 3 months from now I will be 100% back on track x0x0x0

#4 Apr 26 - 7PM (Reply to #17)

Susan32

The physical bond

I think the ex-Psych prof (he even diagnosed himself as a psychopath, rather than just a narcissist) was the cold, calculating kind. He wanted to see me depressed, suicidal, crazy, dropping out, NOT graduating... and when I failed in all those respects, he REALLY didn't know what to do except falsely accuse me of being "dangerous to children" when I was in a teacher education program (karma is cool because I was successfully a tutor in OR) The ex-P would stare me down. During the final D&D, when I was publicly weeping, he'd stand there, cold-eyed, lecturing me on "inappropriate behavior." He'd stare me down over lunch... yet when I stared him down, it made him beyond uncomfortable. "You are very fortunate you never got intimately involved with this man"- I didn't get involved sexually/romantically with the ex-P.... because his ex-boyfriend (a fellow prof) warned me. While the ex-P turned me on... I NEVER felt comfortable enough to take it to the bedroom. Sometimes, I'd be shaking when I was with him. My body would tense up. It's no wonder the ex-P WANTED to get me into the bedroom ASAP-because he knew that if I were his lover, I'd be more controlled, and I wouldn't deal Narc injuries on him shamelessly and gleefully. He doesn't contact me. Sometimes, he'd AVOID me-whenever I was happy, being myself, or ridiculing him. I still follow those rules. He'd say that people mocked him in order to defend themselves from him...he was paranoid that people were mocking him behind his back. If I had had sex with him, I would've NEVER compared him to a tantrum-throwing toddler in a mocking, passive-aggressive way- there would've been that bond. I would've thought "He was my boyfriend. I gave myself to him. That's insulting." Instead, at the time, I thought (and I was laughing while I was doing it),"I'm making fun of him! Comparing a teacher to a toddler! HA HA HA HA!!!! That's insulting! What great fun! Bring it on!!!" The memories haunt me too. I'm grateful I NEVER got desperate enough to have sex with him.

#5 Apr 15 - 5AM (Reply to #13)

agnesmurphy17

Connections

I am almost TWO years out of my marriage. We are completely NC. And I am still having "ah ah" moments. I am still making connections which I did not see before. And I too am haunted. Mine is very creepy. The manipulation was over the top. And I agree, the sex thing is very weird. I left mine when all that weirdness started. But, I did not understand so clearly at the time. I believe that I am permanently damaged. i used to believe that people were essentially good. I do not believe that any more. I am extremely jaded now. And I see the world & the people in it very differently. However, I have also been changed in a positive way. I am so much more grateful all for the good people that I do have in my life & I enjoy all of life's simple pleasures so much more.

#6 Apr 15 - 11AM (Reply to #14)

neverlookback

I agree

I think I also have some damage that is permanent, and YES YES YES I enjoy lifes simple pleasures so much more, I think that comes with the experience of this and knowing what is truly important in this life time and appreciating it. I think the permanency of our damage however will lessen in years to come, it wont be considered damage anymore but more like GREAT GREAT WISDOM. There is no greater example having survived and conquered what we have and in the end leading us to peace within ourselves, WE ARE TRULY HEROES and in time we will one day see that.

#7 Apr 18 - 9AM (Reply to #15)

Smitten Kitten (not verified)

I used to enjoy life's simple

I used to enjoy life's simple pleasures BEFORE the Narc. I was content with my life and I was happy for the most part, even if my marriage wasn't all that happy and I was lonely. I was in denial too at the time, and while ignorance may not be bliss, sometimes it's a whole lot better than knowing. Now my life is a mess and I don't enjoy much of anything, because I'm still so heartbroken and sad over a TURD who doesn't even deserve the time of day.

#8 Apr 18 - 11AM (Reply to #16)

neverlookback

smitten

you brought up a good point, I as well was not living the hell I am living now trying to recover - even though i was and still am in a marriage that makes me feel very lonely, now I AM STILL LONELY and now I have this to recover from, I have always appreciated the fact my husband NEVER was a cheater, and could never imagine living a life with a man that did that behind my back, NOW I KNOW the life it would be, I got just a small taste of it with this affair. Look what I do, I take up with a psychopath. I know I was prey I know this but if I had been happy in my marriage this would have NEVER happened. I tried to find happiness, we have gone to counseling the whole bit thru the years I think i reached such a low in my life when my parents died that I needed to feel loved by someone, I was NOT after cheap sex I wanted someone that I thought was more suited for me, he offered his friendship and I trusted him and he knew I was easy prey. Just my damn luck I ran into a damn predator you could smell NEED and Vulnerability all over me a decent healthy man would have NEVER taken advantage of a woman in that manner, but as you know they pretend to be decent and we find out too late. By the way, I got your message, Whew yours sounded so much like someone I knew once on this board, they all sound the same after all betrayal is betrayal, same cheating, same lies, they are all from the same mold and they all fabricate stories they say ANYTHING that will get them what they want.

#9 Apr 13 - 10PM

Smitten Kitten (not verified)

"It is written that they

"It is written that they NEVER learn from their mistakes, I question that - I think they become skilled by trial and error, what worked on one victim may not work on another, so as they move from one victim to the next, maybe they learn from their mistakes in the past that caused that victim to leave. I think they improve their act by trial and error. It was a long long time before he took his mask off, he really made sure he had secured my deep love and trust before he tightened the screws so to speak, and yet even when his mask fell he still knew he had to keep me thinking I was special to him, he always had the ability to make me feel as if I was special, even thru all the abuse." I completely agree with this. Mine decided to change up his entire Facebook persona and everything else he was doing =regarding the attention seeking behavior and interaction he had with other women that he was constantly flaunting in my face as well as the previous victim. Suddenly, overnight, he recognized the mistakes he made with us and didn't want to repeat them with her? Like she was so frickin' special he was going to be a new, and different man. He actually said to me, "This is my real personality." Please. He wanted to "put his whole heart into really trying to make this work." Like he suddenly had an epiphany and realized that the way he had treated the rest of us all along was wrong. Helloooooo? Nice that you're now going to straighten up and fly right after you put me, the previous GF, your wife, and who knows how many countless others through the ringer. What REALLY happened is that he recognized the way he behaved and treated us so disrespectfully, by flaunting and triangulating other women so shamefully in front of us for short-term validation, shortened our supply life with him, made us catch on to his game that much sooner, and started calling him on his shit. He recognized at some point that his interaction with other women, while giving him a short-term boost because of our jealous reactions, ultimately killed the goose that laid the golden egg. So along comes victim number whatever, and he changes up his whole act, because he knows it won't fly with her this time, because he already broke her heart once 25 years ago, she's re-bounding from her Narc ex-husband and has her guard up. So he literally does a 180 and re-invents himself overnight because, quote unquote, "I don't want to make the same mistakes that I made with you and J____" Which translates to, I need to work harder to get this one under my spell because she's already suspicious, and be able to con her longer by demonstrating that I am completely trustworthy, so I need a new strategy, since what I did with you and J______ ultimately led you to see through my game, call me on my shit, shortened the relationships and ultimately led to their end. I need someone I can con into being in a long-term relationship so that I have constant, reliable supply. That's why I have to pretend even more that I am not the snake I really am, so "she will never have a reason to doubt me." She's going to be my secondary supply for years to come if I play my cards right, and once she completely trusts me, which I'm ensuring by eliminating all the women "friends" in my life and even letting her look through my phone (which I've always kept locked), she will learn to trust me, give in, and then I can go back to the way I have always been.

#10 Apr 14 - 1AM (Reply to #10)

neverlookback

Smitten- excellent perspective of how they operate

YES and this is how mine can stay with his GF, he has found a woman he can CON and she stays with him. He is 55 now so no doubt he has MASTERED keeping his affairs from ever being known. Every single partner they are with are only USED for various reasons of course, they figure, hey I have a partner that adores me, I can go through all the motions so she believes I love her as she loves me, and at the same time I am not left alone, she will be there, I can have my other side secret life pursue married UNAVAILABLE women PERFECT for me because I I dont want to switch my current supply anyway she is too convenient and I trained her for many years to trust me. Personally, I think his GF is his beard, I TRULY TRULY DO, this man begged me to get another man for both of us, now that is just too strange. I think he will always hide behind this woman so the public will never know what he really is, he NEEDS her but DOES NOT LOVE HER, SHE thinks he does I am sure but the man was so pathological,evil sadistic, and he was hell bent on my total destruction, no remorse, and exhibits psychopathic traits right out of the text books and by my counselor. Only a diabolical man could pull of what he does. He is calculating and he picks his victims very very carefully. He figures gee its not so bad living with a woman, we take some vacations a few times a year, (geez I have to go with someone why not her) when i need back up sex she is always there and willing, she is cute, has a job, I dont have to totally support her, I get meals, my bed changed, my home is always clean, all I have to do is pretend I love her and she will stick around, and maybe she will take care of my sick ass when I get older. But she will NEVER know of the sick crap I do in my other life, NEVER. I must hide that very carefully from her, I know how to play her pretty well after 8 some years and when she starts to get needy for attention from me I will just screw her real good that will satisfy her for a week and I can always tell her I am tired, I worked overtime, I cant get it up like I used to, I can think of a million excuses and only have sex with her when I absolutely HAVE TO to shut her up. I KNOW this is how they operate, every person in their life is a TOOL, EVERYBODY. A tool they use to get the job done, they have absolutely no emotional attachment to any human being, and I wondered why I wish I could have been his GF, to only be used to hide who and what he really is. I like the way you think, you are very wise - you keep going in that direction for you truly see how they con and use everyone in their life. It still hurts ever so deeply to know that I was not that human being that could have touched his heart, and because he was so disordered he never even really knew what he lost when I let him go

#11 Apr 13 - 9PM

dazed and seeki...

Thank you. I need to read

Thank you. I need to read this over and over again. I felt like your post really spoke to the situation I am currently struggling with. I feel conned. My mind understands a whole lot since I began obsessively researching. His hoovering is undoing my heart - and my mind and gut are working to hold strong to my conviction that he is bad for me. You're so right about a lot of this. And it IS scary - how they fine tune their tactics, so it only gets worse and worse. I hate that. I feel like there needs to be more out there about these disorders and how they destroy people. But I find it even difficult to talk about with my closest friends who are all highly competent compassionate and intelligent women. It's so odd how hard it is to empathize w/o having gone through this yourself. It's good to know that with continued NC you begin to ACCEPT the truth.

#12 Apr 13 - 9PM

Steph

"They CANT LOVE, nor do they

"They CANT LOVE, nor do they ever truly love anybody they are with and that is all I need to know. Closure can be as simple as knowing that and moving on to how I want to be loved." So true and when you REALLY get that...you stop trying to make sense of them, or wondering why they do this or that or say this or that. You get that NOTHING you do impacts them in any real way...positive or negative. You have reached that understanding, and that is HUGE! Thanks for sharing! xoxo

#13 Apr 12 - 4AM

skystar

I know that his life was

I know that his life was better while I was with him. Mine wasn't. A normal man would look around and be reminded that I did that for him. Not this man. He did it. He did it all right - cut off his nose to spite his face. He's been married 9 times. Probaby as many x-girls friend as days in the year. He's running out of fools. Does the supply ever run out?

#14 Apr 14 - 12PM (Reply to #6)

Veronrose

OMG, married NINE times!?!?

OMG, married NINE times!?!? Jeeze. What a freakin loser!!

#15 Apr 12 - 4AM

candy

You are so exactly right in

You are so exactly right in everything you have said ... i have sent you a private message xx

#16 Apr 12 - 3AM

gettinbetter

Exactly and that's how I

Exactly and that's how I responded to the marriage text. I said it was all a lie and I got conned plain and simple. I also took a jab at him and said that I knew his text was sent with intent to harm. I then I went on to say interesting that you want harm me that would implie that that I get to you in some way. Then I went on to say that I was taking control of my situation and that I would heal from this in a healthy functional way as opposed to the unhealthy dysfunctional way I had in the past. I'm sure it made his skin crawl. The thought of me taking control of myself and my exposing his true motive for sending that text and implying that I knew I got to him.. He knows I see right thru him

#17 Apr 12 - 4AM (Reply to #3)

dudette

Good on you SOI

I hope he had a shrudder of horror when you told him you were getting control back away from him!

#18 Apr 12 - 3AM

dudette

Excellent progress NLB

I am here too. Sadly in a way... I have read both pieces and yes, he did ALL of it. And that is why NC is so essential isn't it? because for those of us who still have a moment of doubt, it would be so easy to fall back under the spell.... I am "playing dead" I would rather not run the risk of being hovered and heartbroken again.... When I found out about the first OW, I felt sick for days and said to him, you will never make me feel like this again. When I dumped him and was so confused, I felt like it again but much worse and much longer. nearly killed me. Fool me once.... No more. Dodging bullets all the way but I can really feel the difference.

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