Will I ever stop obsessing, I can't stop no matter how hard I try

Will I ever stop obsessing, I can't stop no matter how hard I try
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I over analyze everything to begin with, just my person, now with him being gone, living with his whore, I over analyze to the point of obsessing. I wonder sometimes if i can convince myself to hate him so much that i wont rent him space in my head. then I can't I can't hate him for but a moment, then the obsessing starts, I start believing that he will wake up tomorrow transformed, but only for her, and become this amazingly honest, kind, empathetic human being, but only for her, as he never was with me. I obsess over their relationship, and we all know what ever he tells me about it is a lie, or a concoction to make me feel sorry for him. I dont know what really goes on, im not there, but I obsess and wonder, is he happy and just saying hes miserable? I obsess about how he feels about playing family with her and her sometime kid, does he like it, cause he never liked it here, he never liked his own kids, unless it was a convenience. I obsess about how much they enjoy each other, etc.........will i ever stop obsessing, i try so hard, but its eating me alive. someone please respond,,,,,,,,,,im tired of the obsessing...........

jaycee's picture

I had another question for lisa e scott

Hi lisa, I posted a question on this thread, i hope you will read it, its quite long, sorry, but I really need to hear your view on it, as I am having such a difficult time this week. Im obsessing over obsessing, lol. so questions may sound stupid but to me they are important. I left it under the subject lisa e scott. Thank you jaycee

helldweller's picture

Interchangeable

MsVulcan, Susan, others,
This is one of the hardest things to fathom with these people: that we are all the same except in one respect: we all don't provide the same amount of supply. It took me a long time to accept that he had actually replaced my two daughters and me with one four year old child, until I realized what he was getting for that. You would think that he would have kept me and my girls as well as taking in the new, adoring child: four for the price of one, right? No way. By keeping the child and getting rid of us, he was making HIMSELF a much better supply magnet (attracting hundreds of accolades every week from women, men, colleagues, you name it, for appearing to have taken in a little foster child as a single dad). He was also giving him the chance to stroke his OWN ego everyday, patting HIMSELF on the back for being a single dad caring by himself for a foster child.

Unlike us, there is NO concern for the well being of the child. I still cry because my daughters don't really have a father in their life and in their home. The lack of a mother for his child is of NO concern to the narc. The only thing that matters is the ability to generate supply--so he tans, he flirts, he makes his eyes twinkle, and he keeps the single selfless dad charade going. It's amazing. I've watched him from a distance on the playground these past two weeks and he is without a doubt the most popular parent in school. I didn't see what I expected: women fawning all over him. But everyone is like his best friend, so talkative with him and friendly, and they all know him by name, though he doesn't know anyone else's. He doesn't need to. He probably has the ones who babysit programmed into his phone under: "woman with brown hair and glasses" or "woman with deaf son" for when he needs a sitter==or a blow job.

kiwi10's picture

my psychologist told me today

when i asked her how to stop that we need to realize WHY we do it. we obsess over them to avoid our pain. it's a drug for us just like they need their supply. it's the same damn thing.
try when you are thinking about him to think about yourself. about the first person that abused you. try to swee yourself in third person, as a wounded child and hug her. i guarantee you will hurt, cry, and feel REALLY sad, but you will stop thinking about him... that's what it did for me.

Lisa E. Scott's picture

To Obsess or Not Obsess

I truly believe we must go through the process of obsessing about it and over-analyzing it before we can move on.

As I've said before, our minds must make sense of the chaos and trauma we experienced before we can hope to stop thinking about it.

Each of us needs to find an outlet in which to give creative expression and form to what we experienced. To give it some structure and organization so that we can file it away and put it to rest once and for all. For me, this outlet was my book and my music CD.

Once we do this, the obsessive thoughts should lessen, but ONLY if we allow ourselves to FEEL.

Fierflie makes an excellent point:

We continue to obsess over them to avoid our pain. It's a drug for us, just like they need their supply.

Exactly, obsessive thoughts are a reaction to anxiety that we feel.

No one likes to feel anxiety so we find ways to numb or decrease our anxiety. One way we do this is through engaging in obsessive compulsive behavior.

Just as a drug, we can use obsessive thoughts to avoid having to FEEL.

It took me forever to figure this out, but when I did, it really opened my eyes.

By obsessing, overanalyzing and staying "in our head" we avoid having to really FEEL the emotions that are trying to pour out of us.

It is for this reason that it's so important for us to encourage each other to move on to Steps 3 through 6 once we have made sense of the madness we experienced and understand what happened to us.

My point is that every step is important. We cannot skip Steps 1 and 2 (Get It Out & Understand It) or it will only come back to haunt us later in life.

But do remember, when you get to the step of trying to Live in the Now, if you find yourself obsessing, stop and ask yourself if you're really having an emotion. Odds are you are having a strong emotion and you are engaging in obsessive thought to avoid having to deal with the real and very present emotion bubbling inside of you.

You will often find when you are stuck in an obsessive-compulsive cycle of thought that you are trying to avoid having to feel. By obsessing, over-analyzing and distracting yourself with mind rituals, you can easily forget all about what emotions you were just experiencing.

A member of my OCD support group called it "Mental Gymnastics," which always resonated with me because my OCD consists of major mind rituals - or as she so eloquently put it - Mental Gymanastics.

Think about it, if you're engaged in Mental Gymnastics, who has time to FEEL?! Not me!

Please don't forget that if we don't process what happened to us by over-analyzing it and obsessing about it in the beginning, it will come back to haunt us later.

So while I encourage this behavior in the beginning of your recovery, I do not encourage it as you begin to move on.

If you find yourself obsessing after you've already worked through the first few steps, you need to stop and ask yourself:

"What FEELING am I trying to avoid FEELING right now?"

Angry
Mad
Sad
Glad
Ashamed/Guilt
Fear

I guarantee, you will find that there is a very strong emotion or feeling you are trying to avoid. We have to stop being afraid to feel our feelings. Many of us were brought up to believe that we should never be angry or mad or even sad. This is not realistic and is a very unhealthy way of thinking.

We should never numb our feelings with methods of distraction, whether it be drugs, alcohol, or obsessive thoughts. We must not be afraid to FEEL!

I will talk more in the new book about the importance of FEELING OUR FEELINGS!

ShaynasMommy's picture

yes we are totally disposable.....to them

that reminds me of a narc bitch woman I worked for a short time as a therapist/intern for her twin boys who were autistic. There was a team of about 5 of us. One day she got a wild hair up her ass ( I think her and the hubby were having problems again ) anyways and informed us in a very nasty tone that none of us, as employees were "irreplaceble."
Well, She wasnt giving me enough hours to make ends meet, and as a student I was living on my own and needed $$$, so I opted for a job at a local daycare instead. I gave her two weeks notice, but she insisted we work on Thankgsgiving ( I know WTF????) I was a no-show. She called me then to tell me "thanks for, ONCE AGAIN, ruining our program." I said thanks for the opportunity and I'll come in for my check at the end of the month. When I did, she gave me a cold look and handed me the check, but before I walked away I told her, "BTW, you as an employer are not irreplaceable."

Now, if only I could have dealt with the N that way from the get go!

ShaynasMommy's picture

And......

armed with all the insight Ive gained here, I now know that she was a narc b/cause of the way she idealized my skills at the beginning, abused me(us) in the middle (the "irreplaceable comment), and d&d'ed me at the end ("thanks for ruining our program) accusing me of abandonement! Along with her drinking, wild $$$ spending, and rude & vain behavior, I don't have to wonder about that bimbo again! yay me!

better off's picture

Without a doubt... I love

Without a doubt... I love how they reverse themselves. So, you are not irreplaceable... but if you leave you have ruined the program... that makes a lot of sense. lol

I feel like they think "your life is totally unimportant, now give it to me, I need it." Can you hear the big slurrrrping sound as they drain you dry?

I was once the right hand girl for a narcissistic employer...we were best buds and he was my mentor. He was Tony Stark and I was Pepper Potts, right? I turned myself inside out for him and his business, and he needed me night and day. Oh, until someone publicly said I had done a really good job on project XYZ, hadn't I? And he stared at me in this group of people and finally said, "Well if she hadn't done, it somebody else would have." Who this invisible someone else is I don't know... but it was like being slapped in the face, and everyone there literally GASPED. And the poor guy who made the original comment looked devastated for setting it up. I just shrugged and walked away... but the D&D had begun.

Then it was all kinds of little things, and then some big ones, like him telling me to tell clients my work was HIS. I was speechless. He said they didn't trust me because I was so young, so I should tell them he did the work and I was just showing it to them. I'm like, gee, I wonder why I'm bringing in all the money if all these people don't trust me? He was so JEALOUS of me doing exactly what he'd groomed me to do that he couldn't stand it. And cut off his nose to spite his face! When I found out I got paid 20% less than everyone else (all men who worked FOR me), I quit. He said, I can do what you do, but I need those other people. I said, okay then. Do it.

For five years he begged me to come back... but before I'd left, one of the men there gave me the lecture about having your finger in the bucket of water, and when you pull it out it doesn't leave a hole. I said, okay. You won't miss me then. Dumbasses.

Like you, SM, I wish I could have had that attitude in an intimate relationship.

I came down with a very serious case of pneumonia the next day after leaving there! And even tho I was so replaceable and unnecessary, a foreman called me and begged me to come deal with this project, in December, out in the rain. When I had pneumonia. After I quit. That was a big help tho, because it sealed my decision!!!

Lisa E. Scott's picture

Jaycee

Briseis is right, the moment we tell ourselves to stop obsessing about something, we will obsess about it more. It's so unfair, but so true. Think about it. If you tell a group of people not to look at the elephant in the room, the first thing everyone is going to do is want to look at the elephant in the room, right?

The main reason we obsess is UNCERTAINTY. We hate UNCERTAINTY. When something in our life is unclear or uncertain, we will obsess about it until we think we can create some kind of certainty.

The first thing to understand here is that nothing in life is certain. Until we accept this, we will never stop obsessing. What's the old saying, the only thing in life that is certain is death and taxes. So sad, but also true if you think about it.

We cannot control things that happen to us in life. However, we CAN control how we respond to life. I believe this is the biggest predictor of our success. Happiness or success in life is 10 percent what happens to us and 90 percent how we respond to it. THIS is where we have the ability to control our destiny.

However, to think there are things in life we can control that we cannot, will only lead us to bang our head against the wall and obsess until we go crazy. Trust me, I've been there. I did lose my sanity at one point in my life trying to force CERTAINTY where there could be none.

My OCD therapist always told me that I need to "Learn to live in the gray" and this has helped me tremendously. Life is messy. We have to stop thinking in extremes - black or white thinking is not healthy. Things don't have to be all good or all bad. They can be somewhere in the middle and to be honest, that's really what we should expect. We should never expect perfection. Life is a journey, an adventure and like I said, it's messy. It's not meant to be perfect or easy. Thinking it should be is not realistic and will only lead to disappointment.

In life, we need to accept that there are things we can control and things we cannot. The only person we can control is ourselves, which is wherein lies our ability to succeed. It's how we RESPOND to life that MATTERS as long as we understand what we can and cannot control. Think the Serenity Prayer!

In addition to accepting this fundamental truth about life, I believe there are three ways to help reduce our obsessing. The first is to "Get it Out" and process our feelings about it. We need to make sense of the trauma we experienced. Until we do, we will continue to obsess. "Getting it Out" is the soul purpose of the First Step. I truly believe we must give structure and form to the trauma we experienced. That is why we are here.

The second remedy is to "Understand It" which is another reason we are here. Knowledge is Power.

The third remedy is to "Accept It." You mentioned wondering if he's happy with the new woman. Until you accept that he has moved on and do not care whether he is happy or not, you will obsess about him. The best remedy for this is to get to a point where you do not care if he's happy or not. It takes time to get to that point, but I assure you that you will. In time, you will be so grateful that you are no longer in a relationship with him subjecting yourself to abuse. You will actually feel sorry for the new woman.

Trust me, as we've discussed before, he is not happier. They are never truly happy. They don't know how to experience that emotion and will continue to obtain and discard new sources of supply througout their lives, but never fill the void they feel inside themselves.

The good news is that we CAN feel. We can experience love and joy. As we move through the Six Steps, we will find this for ourselves. Be patient with yourself and know that this serenity will come to you in time and that we are here for you. xoxo

jaycee's picture

jaycee

Lisa, Thank you for your great words of advice, You are so right in everyway, I pray there comes a day when I don't care if he is happy or not. I pray there comes a day when I thank God he is out of my life and I'm no longer subjected to his constant abuse, emotional and mental abuse, the abuse I have accepted for over twenty years. People that don't understand narcs and the effects on their victims, don't get it. They think abuse is only physical and since I am not mamed on the outside, they feel that there couldnt have been real abuse. If you ever heard the way he talks to me when he is raging, you would cringe with hatred, I wish when I cringed I could become hateful, but Im stuck wishing the illusion still existed, because I can't let go and accept he has moved on. The thought of him giving this woman my illusion, horrifies me, eats me alive, its not fair, I put up with his crap for so many years, yet, he moves on without a thought, not a care for those he has devastated, and is now playing mister wonderful to another. Although, we here, know what he is, which is a total monster, she is living the illusion of having the man of her dreams, the one she fought so hard to win. That kills me, if she only knew what he were truly about, I would feel better. It may take her twenty plus years to accept it, and he could possibly stay with her that long. He is able to get his ego stroked with her and live for free with her, and she buys him everything, and he can cheat all he wants, she has no idea. I pray someday very soon, I dont care anymore.........xoxoxo too you and thank you for this site. Jaycee

Lisa E. Scott's picture

Jaycee and Imabloke

Jaycee - Believe me, there will come a day where you realize how much better off you are and not care whether he's happy or not. Believe me, he is not happy. He will never be happy.

Imabloke - I'm glad you found the info. helpful and are experiencing healing through CBT. It truly is the best form of therapy out there for obsessive thoughts. I cannot recommend it more highly.

Big Hugs to you both!
Lisa

jaycee's picture

lisa e scott

Lisa, just a quick question, you say he is not happy, and he will never be happy, but do narcs have the sick ability to believe they are happy? or do they truly know they are unhappy with everyone and everything around them? jaycee

Lisa E. Scott's picture

Jaycee

They are capable of fooling themselves for awhile to believe they are happy, but deep down they know they are miserable.

They are jealous of us because we have the ability to feel.

My EXNH was also manic depressive. He would have extreme highs where he was on top of the world.....king of the world, but then extreme lows where he was practically comotose.

On more than one occassion, in moments of weakness, my EXNH told me that he felt like a fraud.

Now, you tell me. I know I've never felt like a fraud. Can you imagine being happy if you felt like a fraud? I certainly cannot.

To me this proves that they will never truly be happy. Yes, at times they are able to fool themselves into believing they are on Cloud 9, but down deep they wish they could feel the way we do. It's sad, really.

jaycee's picture

lisa e scott

Lisa, thank you for replying, I sometimes wonder, does he convince himself he is happy, or is does he truly know he will never be happy. you are right, im sure there are days when he feels he is completely happy and is where he wants to be, but i know there are days when he is completely miserable, and knows nothing can make him happy. but the times he is on cloud 9, my hN is so twisted that i truly believe he thinks hes happy. i dont think he knows what he wants, because his mental state is so twisted, he continues to pretend he loves me, misses me, and wants me, but at the same time, hes telling her all she wants to hear so as to make pretend hes in a happy place. i wonder how happy one can be when they are lying to a multitude of women, and especially to themselves. my daughter told me yesterday, i need to move on, and start dating and becoming a person again, because her father is a liar and doesnt care about any of us, i told her i know that, but its to painful to accept it everyday, it hurts so bad, and yes, i want to cry instead of obsess, but i guess obsessing helps me hold in the real feelings of anger, saddness, and heartache, although i cry everyday, i obsess to help hold back the flood gates, im so afraid if i let it go completely i will never stop crying. i loved this man, worshipped and adored him since i was in college, and have allowed him to control my emotions ever since, but accepting, and i have, that he never loved me, has been the saddest thing i have ever felt in my life. there are days, when i regret throwing him out so bad i want to die, i say if only i didnt at least hed be here and not there, but in reality, what good would it be to have him here, chasing him around, following him, checking his phone, searching for his secret phone, wondering if he is with her at lunch time, etc... somedays i would take those days back, and others, i say, i just couldnt do it anymore, but i really thought when i threw him out, he would go on his own, i never realized how easy she would make it for him, not having to pay a cent, her buying him everything, taking him away on the weekends, taking him out to dinner, all new clothes, shoes, sneakers, etc......she fought me tooth and nail to win him, as he wouldnt leave, but she won by pushing me to the edge, so when i do regret throwing him out, i say, at one point, he would have left anyway, she wanted him more than life itself, she would have gotten her way no matter what, they screwed around for over two years before i had enough, there's no telling what promises they made to each other. I only hope he continues his ways, and eventually moves onto another, as he is not a forever person, but he plays one very well. one more question for you, is it characteristic of a narc, to continue on a daily basis with their estranged wife, to want to keep them close, continue to make promises, tell them they love them and miss them and wish this never happened. yet, continue to live with the ow. i mean, since he pays all the bills here, and ive tried nc, but that enraged him, need him right now to pay everything, as i lost my full time job, do narcs hang onto their wives months after they are thrown out and living with the ow. he cant be that happy there, as he cant go a day without coming here or calling or texting, yet, hes not concerned with the kids, just with making sure i still love him and am waiting for him to go on his own. he tells me everyday how unhappy he is with her and that as soon as we refinance the mortgage hes getting his own place, he tells me he doesnt love her, shes a convenience, yet, he lives with her, and is making a life with her, playing the dutiful boyfriend, im not sure if all narcs do this, is mine just completely pathological and trying to fool himself? my friends say he is a sick bastard and they hate him and they have never heard of a guy living with ow and continuously trying to be with his wife. it is more twisted than anything ive ever heard of, do they all do this? ex. yesterday he came to supposedly see our daughter and she made another comment in front of him, saying mom, you need to move on, sorry dad, she needs to start dating, hes said, i dont want your mom to ever date, i would go crazy. now thats twisted. please let me know what you think?????

Lisa E. Scott's picture

Jaycee

I'm sorry he is putting you through this. While I can't say that all narcissists do this, I can tell you I know many women whose husbands have moved out to live with the OW, but continue to contact their wife and tell them how much they love them and want to be with them.

Malloryforest who I haven't seen on the board in awhile had a very similar situation to yours. Her husband moved in with his new girlfriend, but continued to try to win Mallory back. It went on for months. He begged for her to come back to him while he was living with his new girlfriend. Unbelievable. Hang in there and stay strong! xoxo

jaycee's picture

jaycee to lisa e scott

Lisa, thank you so much for answering the question. I too, am sorry he is doing this to me. As for him begging to come back, no, hes not, hes just mind fn me to death. I dont believe he wants to come back, although, i never say i want him back, i do tell him, i just want him to be on his own so he can have some kind of relationship with his children. i have never asked him to come home, i just want him on his own or to move onto the next. He says all the things i want to hear, yes, im moving out soon, i dont have anywhere to go yet, but it wont be long, no i dont love her, no i dont want to be there, yet, he is still there. he continues to tell me he loves me more than anyone in the world, and she could never compare, yeah right, thats why ive been replaced by her, and that he could never replace me, ever. sorry a little late there. I wonder if Mallory had said yes, would her husband had left the girlfriend, or was he playing her, like mine is playing me, keeping one foot in the door, just in case. who knows, but thank you for answering the question, maybe not all narcs behave this way, but at least i know its not unusual. i wonder what will happen when i do finally move on, hopefully, if i ever can, what would he do then, he already tells me he doesnt want me to date ever.......the nerve.......

Lisa E. Scott's picture

Jaycee

The nerve is right. He tells you not to date, but it's ok for him to do whatever he wants. Their sense of entitlement is unbelievable.

Trust me, don't question whether you'll move on or not. You will. It may take time, but you will move on. How do I know this? Because you know the truth. Just being here is proof that you no longer have your head buried in the sand.

Many people lie to themselves about their relationship so they don't have to do the hard work of breaking it off. I know I lied to myself for years that my marriage with my EXNH was ok. I didn't want to believe that prince charming was not who I thought he was.

However, once I understood narcissism it explained everything to me. Once I saw his true colors, I could never look at him the same way again. I'm sure you feel the same way about yours.

Once the mask has been lifted and we are honest with ourselves, I don't believe it's possible for us to stay with them. We may go back and forth for awhile, but at the end of the day, we know they are an empty shell trying to suck the life out of us. Once you know this and understand this, I don't believe it is possible to stay with them.

Sorry for rambling. My point is, don't question whether you WILL ever move on. That is not a question. You WILL move on. It's simply a matter of WHEN you will move on. You know the truth now and it's just a matter of time before you are in a much better place.

Be patient with yourself and know you are not alone. We are here for you. xoxo

jaycee's picture

jaycee to lisa e scott

thank you lisa, you are right, i do know who and what he is but im still obsessing, still pining over him wishing things were different, i know at the end of the day he is a nothing lying narc, but i hate that he is with her, i hate he is living with her, now shes adding salt to my wounds and posting their pics of fb, we had a terrible blowout over it yesterday, talked on another post about it, but it doesnt matter what he says, hes a liar and there is nothing about him i can believe, and thats scary. i pray i can move on soon, as i am becoming physically ill over all of this. just tell me, he will eventually leave her too and move onto the next, as she, of all his affairs, was the most unbelievably cruel to me, and now shes gloating on fb, how embarrassing for her though, flaunting all over town that she won my husband and he lives with her now, and posting pics of her and him on fb. funny how she has no idea hes cheating on her left and right, and still professes his love to me, and denies loving her, pls tell me she will see him without the mask soon and he will move onto the next soon.........

jaycee's picture

Jaycee and Iamabloke

Lisa, thank you and I pray you are right, there will be a day when I wont care if hes happy or not. I know deep in my heart if he were happy he would not behave the way he does, first of all, hes a narc, so he will never truly be happy, but he does have a way of convincing himself he is happy, for the moment, he gets complacent, as long as he gets his way, he feels comfortable, which right now, is eating me alive, the longer he lives with her, the more comfortable he gets, hes one of those people who don't won't make a move if it requires any effort, everything has to come too him. so as long as he doesnt have to make any effort, he will stay where he is and just live his life, cheating, lying, and manipulating through. so if making an kind of effort is required for him to move on, he wont do it, he will stay with her, as for him being there in the first place, i made the great effort of packing his things and dumping them on her doorstep, i thought i was strong enough to deal with it in the first place, then as time went by i began to obsess why he is still with her, i never thought he would stay, i thought he would go to his mom's or move in with a friend, now his living with her and giving her the ultimate illusion is killing me, so much so, i cant function these days, i moody and cry constantly, and cant find my way through life. somedays i wish i would go to sleep and wake up and it be six months ago, and know i couldnt have coped with this, and kept the creep here, why is it getting worse for me, i keep thinking of him being with her for the holidays and its killing me. I know hes a lousy father and nasty excuse for a husband, but he was ours, now he is theirs, playing house with her and her kid, pretending to be interested in her sons football games, when he hasnt seen his own son since he left and returned from Iraq well over a year ago. how can he live with himself knowing all this, and continue to mind f me in everyway shape and form, knowing he can do it because i rely on him paying for everything here in the house. he knows that if i go nc he can stop paying everything, and leave us for dead, so i have to tread lightly and be nicey nice instead of getting to the anger stage and hating him, oh, i wish i could hate him, but i miss his big lug being in our home. i tried no contact for a couple of weeks here and there and he got vicious and threatened to stop paying, now all he does is promise me he is going on his own, he went as far as changing his address back to our home, to prove he is getting his own place, he is such a liar. when she finds out, he'll change it back to there again, im sure. i know im babbling, im so tired from lack of sleep and such anxiety i cant concentrate. please tell me i wont be this way forever, what if im not like everyone else here and i dont stop obsessing and i cant get over it. what if that happens, i just want not to care anymore..........i hope you are right and i wont care someday.........thanks for talking to me and listening to my stupid babble, just having really really bad days lately and need all of your support.......jaycee

imabloke's picture

Jaycee..

I feel for you.. it's awful.. all i can say is try and have as little contact as possible and you need to work on you.. it's easy for me to say i know...
I try and focus on what's important to me right now.. my kids, my job, my health etc..
so when i do something with my kids i make the most of it i concentrate on them, watch what there doing interact etc. It's hard cos as your driving to the cinema i think about her.. but it's getting less and less over time. and when were done watching the movie i think about what we've been doing and what a great time we've had.. it seems to work. Its channeling your thoughts onto more positive happy stuff.
Just my pennies worth.
Things will get better you. You must believe that they will and the will.
imabloke x

Lisa E. Scott's picture

Jaycee

Oh, my heart aches for you right now. I know the pain you're in. Trust me, this too shall pass. You will stop obsessing about him eventually. The recovery process takes time, but please know that you will find so much more happiness than you ever thought was possible if you stay true to yourself and what you know is right.

You know this man is horribly toxic to you and your family. You know you are better off without him and you know he and his new woman will only end in misery.

Michele is right - remember, a Narcissist is incapable of feeling. He will never feel. Do not try to convince yourself otherwise.

Also, NEVER apologize for venting. That is what this board is here for and why we're all here. We understand like no one else. You have to process your feelings in order to move on to the stages of Acceptance and Living in the Now. Until you Get It Out, you cannot move through the stages to find inner peace and happiness. So please, do not hold back and Get It Out, Girl! We are here for you and you are never alone. xoxo

jaycee's picture

jaycee

Lisa, thank you for replying to me. You have no idea how much this site means to me, and how much it means to me that you would speak to me personally. I am in so much pain right now, but your words, that he and his ow will end in misery, give me such hope. hope to finally realize it was not me, and no one can make him happy, not even himself. I know I am better off without him, but the pain is so overwhelming, i cry everyday. the grief is so beyond anything i could have ever imagined. what bothers me the most is my obsessive thoughts, i imagine they are so happy and loving each other up all day long, her giving him all i couldnt, financially, buying him everything he wants, taking him out to resturants constantly, and him pretending to play family with her and her kid. humiliating me all over town being seen together, all these things add to my obsession and my heartache. Please tell me, i am only imagining such happiness there, or if it is true, its only because his mask has fallen yet. sad thing is, he is already, and has always had two others, more im sure, that i know of and he cheats on her constantly, and she has no idea, she's living in bliss, feeling victorious over me, i hope soon, his mask falls and she sees what is really underneath. i hope more, i am only imagining all this because i am being irrational about them. thank you for all your kind words and words of hope and wisdom. xoxoxoxo jaycee

imabloke's picture

Lisa...

This reply is just fantastic...

The first statement.. 'If you tell a group of people not to look at the elephant in the room, the first thing everyone is going to do is want to look at the elephant in the room, right?'

That's exactly how obsessive thoughts work.

Priceless!

I'm having CBT at the moment and it's helping

Lisa E. Scott's picture

More on Managing Obsessive Thoughts

I'm copying and pasting a post I made a couple months ago for easy reference for anyone struggling with obsesive thoughts right now.

Working with a Cognitive Behavioral Therapist (CBT) is unbelievably helpful in managing obsessive thoughts. Here's a little more on the process of CBT, specifically Exposure Response Prevention (ERP). I cannot recommend it more highly, but please be sure you seek out and find a qualified CBT professional.

Tue, 07/27/2010 - 20:17 — Lisa E. Scott
We all want to stop thinking about him, right? We want to stop obsessing, but we don't know how. We cannot erase the Narcissist from our brain. It is not possible. However, we can retrain our brain.

You will have thoughts in the future about your ex that you'd rather not have. You cannot control thoughts that come to mind. Memory is memory. Once created, it cannot be erased.

However, the good news is you CAN control HOW you will respond to the thoughts that pop into your head and that is the key to reducing your obsessive thoughts.

Everyone gets unwanted, intrusive thoughts. Yes, everyone! The difference is people who have not been brainwashed or suffer from OCD do not over-analyze these thoughts or judge these thoughts. They let them roll-off of them. Many just laugh and say, "Ha, what a strange thought" and then move on.

Unfortunately, we don't do that because we are stuck in Cognitive Dissonance and over-analyze and obsess about every little thought. The key is not to judge our thoughts or give them any weight. The minute you judge a thought, you give it more power.

Smart people are extremely creative and imaginative. As we've been talking about in another thread, I believe that we are all very intelligent people. Therefore, all kinds of thoughts and images will pop into our creative minds. The important thing to remember is a thought is a thought. That's it. You need not over-analyze it or judge it.

Exposure Response Prevention is what we will do in Step 5 of our program when we face our fears and find our outlet. We will expose ourselves to our fears, but then prevent ourselves from responding in our typical compulsive way.

You see, Obsessive thoughts are a result of anxiety and Compulsions are what we do to try to reduce the anxiety. i.e. Obsessive-Compulsive Behavior.

Unfortunately, we think engaging in a compulsive behavior will lessen the anxiety, and it might initially, but it is only temporary. In fact, it only increases the anxiety in the long run. Why? Because responding to the anxiety or obsessive thought in any way, shape or form only intensifies it. It validates it. Do not validate the thoughts.

You can observe the thoughts, but do not judge. Do not try to wish the thoughts away because, believe me, that will only make you think of them more. Do not fight your thoughts. To do so creates major Cognitive Dissonance, which only creates more obsessive thought. Allow your thoughts to happen, but do not validate or judge them in any way. Laugh at the thoughts, dismiss them, talk back to them as if they are an unwanted intruder in your mind.

You must realize that these thoughts do not define you and are not a part of you. They are simply thoughts. Look at the obsessive thoughts as a separate entity and you will be able to distance yourself from them, believe me. I call my obsessive thought patterns "The Tormentor" and I talk back to "The Tormentor" when it tries to engage me. No joke.

Oh, and engage me it tries, quite often. I have learned that this is ok. The thoughts will always come. We have no control over that. Do not fight that. If you fight that, you're only setting yourself up for failure. It's like telling people not to look at the white elephant in the room. Everyone is going to look, right? Instead, you do not fight the thoughts or tell yourself not to think of him. You simply control how you respond to the thoughts when they do occur.

We will always have intrusive, unwanted thoughts. Everyone does! The good news is that we have a choice in how we want to respond to these thoughts.

Life is not about what happens to us, it's about how we respond to what happens to us. For me, the key is this:

I will always have intrusive, unwanted thoughts. I cannot control this. However, I can choose whether I want to engage with the thoughts and give them power or see them for what they really are - white noise that tries to distract me from living in the moment.

The key to recovery is understanding that you CAN control HOW you will respond to your thoughts. And that is what makes all the difference in the world for your sanity. By engaging with the thoughts, you only increase the power of the anxiety and fear you are trying to avoid. Tell it to fu*k off and dismiss it. It may sound silly, but trust me, it works.

Practicing this (aka Exposure Response Prevention) has helped me tremendously. I finally have peace of mind I never thought was possible. Again, the thoughts still come, but by choosing HOW I will respond to these thoughts, I have reduced the power and the hold they have over me.

They are only thoughts after all. Thoughts cannot hurt me, but how I respond to my thoughts can hurt me. Being paralyzed with anxiety over thoughts is no way to live life. It prohibits us from enjoying the moment and living life to its fullest.

imabloke's picture

I think we all obsess....

I'm doing it too.. but it is getting less as time goes on.
Over analysing.. I'm doing that aswell - i'm that sort of person too...But if we didn't examine ourselves and others we wouldn't learn anything. We would be like them.. just move on to the next person. That in itself isn't right as we know.
I think its about getting to a healthy - as in the mind - place. Its difficult for you as you share kids so you have to see him. But i'm sure over time and you're on this site where people can help you, things will get better.
As for his happiness errr... he might be happy for a while but over time the cycle will start again.. that is one thing you can be sure of.

allthatglitters's picture

imabloke

I think you're right.. the obsessing, over analyzing, all of that is serving a purpose for us. It's forcing us to stop and learn from what we've been through.

jaycee's picture

i cant stop obsessing

thanks to all for your replies, as I am overwhelmed with obsessing these days, i just pray i can stop, i cant take this much more, i need to forget what they are doing and focus on me. please ask God to answer my prayers, as I need them answered, all of them, so many, but i believe and I know eventually all my prayers will be answered. i hope you all have a good day........and me too.......

Susan32's picture

Humor: The best remedy?

After the D&D, I called a friend of mine on the East Coast... she had come to an understanding of what the ex-P was, and this was no ordinary high school rejection. When I started mocking the ex-P, she said "it sounds like you're beginning to get over him."

Narcs/Psychs want to be on pedestals. Whether it be the pedestal of adoration or the pedestal of hatred. Occultist Aleister Crowley (who drove his wife, as well one of his female lovers, into insane asylums for the rest of their lives) called himself "The Wickedest Man in the World." They want you to WANT to hurt them. Or love them above everything else. They cannot bear mockery.

I found it healing to mock myself (in a non-cruel way) as well as the ex-P (in a cruel way I wouldn't do to my friends/family) Humor is a MUCH better way of dealing with anger. Besides, it's legal. "I hate you, you ruined my life" or "you are the love of my life, I will always always love you" are NS. But "I'm mocking you" means "I'm not taking you seriously."

In the Lord of the Rings, in The Two Towers, Saruman has the Rohirrim under his spell. He's basically lulling them into self-destruction with his charming words, luring them to serve the Dark Lord. But Gandalf breaks the spell of Saruman's speech. How? With laughter.

faithinthefuture's picture

I now can't stop

thinking about pink elephants while snapping 10 rubber bands on my wrist!:-)
I haven't been on board for about a week but I am here every day reading.I just don't know what to say sometimes because there are so many responses that leave me speechless...which is a really hard thing to do but the words of wisdom and encouragement are beyond anything I could even think about putting into words. i do know this i wouldn't be where I am without being able to come here. And I just want to tell everyone with all of my heart thank you! I mean that so sincerely!
I got into a funk last Sun. and haven't seemed to get myself out of it. I don't know what triggered it but my thoughts have been all over the fricking place.
I want soo bad for him to be out of my head. I don't want him back hell I want NOTHING to do with him at all.
I've been NC for almost 6 months and I try not to be so hard on myself because he was a part of my life on & off for 10 yrs.And I went thru nothing compared to so many women on here. But it still hurts and pisses me off. It seems like this last week all these little things I should've have seen are coming to surface. And I'm pissed at myself for letting go of who I was for him. I seriously want to beat the fuck out of him. I won't. but damn it would feel soo good. I don't want him to get away with what he did to me!
but I have to let it go and put it in God's hands. I know that! And I have to be thankful for it ending when it did.
maybe I'm just lonely. I have no social life no friends no one hang out with. I come home every nite and I'm alone. I've never lived in a place my entire life that I didn't make friends to do things with. I've been here 3 yrs and I don't see my life style changing. i like him not being here but still wish i had friends to do things with.
And my 17 yr old daughter lives in the town he does and she wants and needs me to move back there. I am soo many friends there but the thought of being anywhere near him makes me sick to my stomach.
I've rambled and I'm sorry. Just feeling rather lost.

jaycee's picture

i now cant stop

faith, so sorry you are feeling lost, i too feel lost so often. you need to make friends with someone in your town and just go to the movies for coffee once in a while. they the narcs have destroyed so many of us, but we need to have each other and people in our lives to help us through these times, if only you lived near me, i would pick you up take you to dinner and make you laugh all night long. i would do that for anyone, and put my own pain aside, because unlike my hN i am not selfish, and filled with empathy and compassion for everyone. you make me cry, i wish you werent so lonely, but you have us here, and please make friends with people around you, you dont have to tell them your business, just enjoy their company. please feel better, and take yourself to the local starbucks or barnes and noble and sit around and make small talk with people and maybe you might find someone to hang out with. ive met people there before and could have easily hung out with them, but it would be up to you. we all need others, they fill the void. let me know how you are feeling hugs, jaycee

faithinthefuture's picture

Aww jaycee

we could go dutch :-) thank you for your kind words. You my dear have been thru soo much more hell than I ever have and here you are giving words of support. I do hope you know you are an amazing woman! And you know what I know I am too. And I bet we would have a blast hanging out!
I have friends at work who not to blow sunshine up my own ass but then again who else will but...they are a great circle of friends. just they live on the opposite side of the city 45 mins away so socializing doesn't happen.
I like you, can talk to anyone whether in starbucks or a homeless person on the street. Hell the other day this boy about 10 yrs old was yelling! down the street for the school bus to wait for him. damn if it didn't leave without him. this lil guy was about 10 yrs old and just said OH SHIT when the bus left. I was in my driveway and he turned around and looked at me and I said get in my truck we'll catch that damn bus. He smiled and we caught it. MADE MY DAY!
I work in a call center selling insurance and I know I am where I am supposed to be because when I hear the stories of what's happening to families and what they've been thru I say a prayer of thanks for what I have in my life.
I guess I just never thought I would be alone. I feel I have soo much to give and share. Next life huh :-)

michele115's picture

faithinthefuture

I relate to beating the fuck outta him and feeling isolated with no friends i really do...we will get through this though...this board has become my xanax...LOL

Hugs....

faithinthefuture's picture

michele115

you are new aren't you? If not I apologize for not realizing that. But in the last few days I've seen your posts and they are truly amazing!
I am a strong stubborn ass woman..Taurus go figure..and I fricking know I will get thru this. I'll be damned if I will let my relationship with him get me down or keep me from my daughter.
I'm just such a people person and to be where I am without any friends to do things with just fucking blows!
This board is awesome isn't it?!!!!
I know the world now is all about texting and facebook and emails. But I'm 52 & I like actually TALKING to people! Thats whats hard for me. Not having someone to share my day with. My exH(who is one of my best friends) used to tell me I could make any ordinary day seem good to listen about. :-)
My job requires me to take calls 8 hours a day and some days I have no desire to TALK to anyone when I get home and yet for the most part I still could! OMGosh that's messed up! LOL!
Keep writing your words of wisdom. They're good for the soul.

God Bless

michele115's picture

Faithinthefuture...

Just reading your post...Hi there...glad to meet you. Thanks for the compliment...Capricorn over here...something about us earth signs I guess...LOL

Keep on keeping on!
Peace.

kiwi10's picture

michelle's a cap, huh?

love female caps... not so much the men. my spycho ex is a cap.

michele115's picture

I've heard MALE Caps...

Can be a bit of a pill to swallow....

jaycee's picture

will i ever stop obsessing

thank you all for your replies. I know everything all of you say, is such great advice, just knowing others went through this obsessing period too, makes me feel ok. im not crazy its natural and maybe an antidepressant would help, since my anxiety meds are no longer helping, i used to take one and my mind could focus on everything, now, doesnt help i get more anxious on certain days and cant focus on anything but the scum of the earth hN and his whore. I guess when im rational, I know he will never change, guess what, he hasnt changed, it just bothers me so much because she doesnt see the man behind the mask and i worry it will take her years before she does. I just dont want him with her, i wish he would move onto one of the others he is involved with, they never tortured me like this one did. Oh I pray I can stop obsessing long enough to know she will get hers too, and he is already getting his, in everyway possible.

gettinbetter's picture

me too Jaycee

its the obsessive thoughts only they are not about who he is with anymore they are about his sexual perversions. I have no proof but suspect as everything I read says its not a matter of if but when as to when they begin to have perverted behavior

allthatglitters's picture

jaycee

I agree that you need to channel your obsessing into reading more about Ns. You have to start looking at the big picture, even though it's very hard. I had a lot of problems with this initially. But you HAVE to keep reading and getting more knowledge of what it is you actually went through.

This is the only way you're going to progress forward.

Tinker's picture

obsessing

i was going through just that a couple of months ago, and still am to a much lesser degree. as someone replied, an antidepressant helps a lot. also, use that obsession to read everything! i stayed in bed many many hours just reading sites like this (this one's the best:) and eventually it sinks in that it's NOT YOUR FAULT, and HE'S MISERABLE and will always be so. they make us think that if we were only different that all would be wonderful but they know inside their sick little heads that it's them.

it won't work to tell yourself to stop, but give yourself a break, let the thoughts flow in and out, try all the tricks everyone is telling you and it will lessen, you'll get more and more YOU every day, and it'll be less about him. let us know how you're doing....

marissa

better off's picture

Please keep

Please keep reading!

jaycee... please read read read the board. This is discussed over and over and over again in the articles posted, the blog entries, the Share Your Story section, and just in people asking the same questions, even on this very first page.

Use the obsessiveness to read more about the disorder, so you can quell the irrational obsessiveness that somehow he's going to be happy with someone else and someone else's children. If you educate yourself about it, even simply by reading other people's stories, you will see a very clear picture emerge of what they are, and how to get better. Listen to the answers!

And STOP listening to the narc!! You spend way too much time talking to him about his f**ked up personal life and then spend the rest of your time thinking about what he said, which is MEANINGLESS! You need to go NC, so you can stop HIS influence in your mind, and you need to fill that space instead with truth! I know you share kids and there is household stuff but you can limit your interactions to essential info only. Stop feeding the craziness by talking to him.

Members, there is scads of advice here. Please take advantage of it!!

Briseis's picture

It's almost impossible to

It's almost impossible to stop obsessing if you just tell yourself to stop, or wish yourself to stop.

It's like trying very hard NOT to think of a pink elephant. Don't think of the pink elephant!! Are you still not thinking of that pink elephant?? NO pink elephants, now!! What, are you still thinking of that pink elephant??

I'm an old psychiatric nurse, and have had depression off and on my whole life, pretty much. One of my biggest symptoms of depression was obsessive thinking. Obsessive thinking/feeling is actually biochemical, it's a biochemical process in the brain. Once it gets started, just wishing it would stop is not gonna stop it :(

What helped me was getting on an antidepressant, like Celexa or Lexapro. They interrupt those pathways, and rebalance the brain chemistry. They make you feel like a "normal", undepressed person would feel in the same situation. They don't make the problems go away, but they stopped me from going down the rabbit hole, and REALLY helped that obsessive thinking.

Once the antidepressants took hold, it was like I could DO something, I had more power to turn away from all that shit and start making moves toward a healthier life.

Some people take them for six months, or even less. Just to get a leg up on the situation.

They aren't the only answer . . . they are just the one thing that really helped me :) .

The other stuff is throwing yourself headlong into a new activity, something that takes up a lot of your internal mindspace. Something that fascinates you. I did this, too, but had to take antidepressants for a couple of months before I could get up the gumption to even DO something new.

It takes time, but it all boils down to the fact that we who obsess have to do something different, we have to change ourselves, get some special kind of help to snap out of it. Just sharing how I finally got free of this :)

Rinalda's picture

Triggers

I was doing better until I sensed another woman fall into place for buddy boy. It's triggered awful feelings I had more or less gotten under control but now can't snap out of.

I'm wary of taking drugs but appreciate that they help some of you. I just don't know how to deal with the frustrations sometimes. Therapy did help but one can't access that kind of support 24/7. This board helps, too. Changing the thought patterns is important but, initially at least, the emotions and anxieties take over. Maybe it's process of adjusting to painful realities, bit by bit, in the mind.

michele115's picture

Breisis

Thanks for the information...I've been through some doozies in my life, but this experience has brought me over the edge. I was very much anti pill up until now, HOWEVER, I think I'm gonna swallow my pride along with a Lexapro. I found a therapist finally...hope she's good, you won't believe what wackos are out there...well being in the industry, maybe you do...LOL scary to say the least, but I think your advice is on point...temporarily putting one down the hatch to get through doesn't make one weak or crazy, it makes one proactive.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different outcome.

Onward and Upward...
Cheers!

Rinalda's picture

Getting through this

I understand the struggle. It sucks. You will start feeling better after a while, but it will take time and effort, I think. Do you have access to therapy? Honest to God, we need it after these people blast through our lives. A therapist will help you see the reality of him, not the illusion you were led to believe in. She or he will help you feel good about you and help you manage the stages of acceptance and grief. I think it's the only real route, actually.

Do you think some of this is related to your self-esteem? That is also something for a therapist to coach you on. Whatever the case with your ex-N's situation, he seems to be a manipulative liar and therefore not a good person for you to be with. Do you feel liberated in any way now, or just completely down in the dumps?

hopefuljms's picture

Believe it or not my

Believe it or not my therapist recommended wearing a rubberband and snapping it every time I thought of him. Beleive it or not it works. I have also tried every time I think of him adding the words D is an asshole and they both have helped. Not totally there yet but baby steps!

allthatglitters's picture

hopeful

this is a great idea. I'm going to start doing this immediately.

ShaynasMommy's picture

Jaycee....(sigh)

"I start believing that he will wake up tomorrow transformed, but only for her, and become this amazingly honest, kind, empathetic human being, but only for her, as he never was with me."

That's kinda like when they get together with you during the honeymoon phase....They'll tell you that you are so amazing that you reformed them, shown them the light, blah, blah. But you find out they are lying later, right? So why would he reform for her?????? That's just fantastical thinking, Jaycee, please think rationally about it. Ain't gonna happen, babe.

" is he happy and just saying hes miserable?"

I think youv'e been reading this site long enough to know that he is NOT a happy person. He is sick, frantic, and desperate for validation from EVERYONE. Doesn't smack of happy to me.

" obsess about how he feels about playing family with her and her sometime kid, does he like it, cause he never liked it here, he never liked his own kids, unless it was a convenience.

If he can't bond with his own offspring, what makes you think he could with someone elses? Yes, they are a convenience, just like EVERYBODY ELSE.

You say you overanalyze things. I say you need to be more rational about things. I dont mean it to hurt you. As I said before, you need to be deprogrammed after al these years. This is just part of the process. We are here to support you, sympathize with you, and also RE-PROGRAMME you, Jaycee. And that involves slapping you silly every once in a while (smile) and calling out the fantastical thinking.

helldweller's picture

jaycee

I'm with you. Same situation. I'm going forward but he is there every second. The wondering about everything, constantly. I'm waiting to hear answers too.

MsVulcan500's picture

This just gave me a thought

I was just thinking as I was reading this thread that we have to remember that at one time we were the most wonderful/special person he had ever met. Then later, we were the most awful/hateful person he had ever met. The ones before us were also the most awful/hateful. So I would surmise that they were also the most wonderful/special at one time.

Since we know we are not the most awful/hateful person he could have ever met, we now assume that the ones before us probably weren't either. So in turn, the NW who is now the most wonderful/special person he ever met is just like all of the rest of us, and she will at some time become the most awful/hateful person he ever met.

We are all the same to him. We are the most wonderful/special person he ever met (while we are being great supply) and we are the most awful/hateful person he ever met (when we start figuring out something just isn't right). The NW is just like us and will suffer the same fate we and all who came before us did.

jaycee's picture

this just gave me a thought

msvulcan, thanks, too bad she wasnt already the most awful/hateful person yet. i hope it wont be long before he starts to feel that, and she figures him out. because his playing family with her and her kid is killing me. he didnt even like his own kids and his real wife, why does he like them. hopefully its all fake...........