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Thank you Janine, Sub Species----the disguised narcissist
betty2020
Member since:
1 year 37 weeks
1 year 37 weeks
Last activity:
51 weeks 3 days
51 weeks 3 days
Thank you Janine, Sub Species----the disguised narcissist
Posted August 30, 2010 - 11:28am
© E. Scott Enterprises | Lisa E. Scott
We are not certified mental health professionals and this site and message board is in no way a replacement for professional therapy, legal or medical advice.
This is my N!
September 1, 2010 - 8:46pm — loveofmylifeSo humble, so self effacing on the outside... the "nicest guy in the world".... so kind ot everyone. Is so modest about his looks....but he spends alot of time perfecting them and perfecting his body!
This is why I didn't pick up on it until the D&D started.
The disguised
August 30, 2010 - 8:53pm — helldwellerGod, it's maddening! They save their evil just for us, and everyone else sees the bumbling, self-depracating, humble, public servant and humanitarian.
Mine would even be self-depracating with me IN WORD ONLY though. If I said, "You are so handsome," he would say, "Oh sure, honey." He would make fun of his big ears and bald spot and vodka belly and wrinkles. Totally endearing. I never had a clue he was dismantling my entire psyche the whole time.
I found out later that he told people I left him because I didn't want his foster child "because his mom was a heroine addict and helldweller didn't want to be bothered with a child who might have difficulties."
When I think about it I want to kill people. I was shaking for a month because the child I thought of as my own was being raised by a maniac who didn't know the first thing about children, took him away from a couple who wanted to adopt him, and locked him in his room at night and made him cry himself to sleep "to get tough."
geee Helldweller
August 31, 2010 - 5:37pm — jen79this guy is a freak! A total psycho, poor kid! Is there anything you can do? YOu must go crazy!
I remember how much I wanted to have a baby from him, but when reading all those stories here, I thank god, it didn't work out.
that's totally mine
August 30, 2010 - 6:52pm — jen79Thats exactly the P. He is presenting this puplic image and everyone is like "awwwww look how sweet and adorable he is, sooo down to earth, someone who hasn't forgotten its roots, and he so much shows his vulnerability".
That's why I thought "(too long), it must be my fault he is that way, it seems he is with everyone different but with me. And this image seems to be so authentic, everyone would fall into that trap. Even now it's still hard for me to believe that this is the same person. Almost as if he is fragmented into different personalities.
But very true, you will recognize this type "just through his actions".
Sounds familiar!
August 30, 2010 - 6:20pm — Susan32The ex-Psych professor was ALSO a covert narcissist. He'd accuse me of narcissism whenever I stood up for myself, but he put on the humility, "poor me" act to reel me in. He said that his fellow professors avoided him because he was the humblest of them all... but if he was such a great, humble guy why did his colleague (who went with him to graduate school) want NOTHING to do with him?
He'd say "I'm not that smart... I'm not that great a teacher"... his way of fishing for compliments. The whole "I'm vegetarian, I love animals"-when he did disclose that animals were AFRAID of him.
Definitely a covert narcissist.
The disguised /covert narcissist
August 30, 2010 - 12:12pm — janineSince Betty and I got into discussing this type, I'll try to explain some more. That sort of N is rare, difficult to see through. I have so far managed to read half of the stories posted here and come across one or two. Perhaps it will be helpful for a few of you, who are with someone who seems to be a N and yet is different.
The one I have been involved with for 11 years is a very somatic type. That part is the same as in overt narcissists, always hunting for supply. Only, despite his good looks, he finds less, because he cannot hide what he is for long. Though he seems soft and compliant on the outside, he is as determined, pragmatic and ruthless as all narcissists. I used to feel that apart from brief phases, he seemed to be surrounded by a grey fog. His kids said the same. There is a constant negativity about everything and a desperate neediness. Though the low self-worth is disguised by the usual N arrogance, it is very much there. So they'll moan, complain, wallow in selfpity without doing anything to change things, because they are "victims".My ex had indeed been that throughout his childhood, badly mistreated and humiliated. The result has been that he had lost the ability to love and feel anything but fear and loathing early on in order to survive. His psychiatrist told me that this man valued and trusted me all he could and relied totally on me. But all typical N acting was there under the disguise plus a lot of rage, and the passive-agressive acting was bad.
So, if there's anyone in a relationship with that sort of N, the advice is the same as with all others: RUN!
Curious...
September 2, 2010 - 12:35am — appleI was wondering what you think mine was? I think it would really help me because I am still so confused.
cherryblossom
September 2, 2010 - 12:53am — NancyMI read your story again, and there is no way your experience was with a covert type. If he is an N then he falls into the somatic category, but I would go so far as to say he has slipped into Psycho territory. It matters little if you nail exactly which disorder he falls under, he is clearly a dangerous man and one that you must stay away from. Hope that helps some. :)
NancyM~ Thank you <3
September 2, 2010 - 9:58pm — appleThank You for clearing that up for me!! I really appreciate it. I'm going three weeks no contact and it has been very painful. He came to see me (I was shocked~couldn't believe he made the effort), I thought we had a great time and then NOTHING from him!!!
I fooled myself into thinking that things were going to change and that he was going to start to make me a priority (that's at least how he made things sound!!) I don't know if I said something wrong? As he seemed to be grilling me the entire time about other guys. He actually said "what is it that you do then?" Uhh... Work, hang out with my friends and family, tend to my life, spend a lot of time outdoors rafting, walk my dog. I mean are you kidding me?
I told him I recently went to a wedding and then he started accusing me of meeting men there. I was like... you just went to a wedding too!! Oh, that was different because it was a family wedding. The double standards go on and on. I told him the rules that apply to me don't apply to you then. Anyways, I thought we had a good time and he left and haven't heard a word after I texted to make sure he got home okay. The final D&D!! May it please be the last!! Anyways, I'm just venting. Thanks for listening and for helping me with the Somatic. xxA
Wow Janine
August 30, 2010 - 7:58pm — mortyI'm looking forward to your story. You've given me lots of insight and I suspect we have similar stories. I know you've read mine. If you ever want to correspond off line, you're welcome to ask Betty for my e-mail address.
I'm looking forward to learning more about this type of N. I think the P/N in my life may lean in this direction.
True, Morty
August 31, 2010 - 3:39pm — janineQuite a bit of what you wrote including your past is similar to what I had. I'll be going on a long relaxing holiday by the sea next week (without laptop and mobile, sheer bliss!) and when I return, I shall be brave and post my story. Then, I am sure, we will have a lot to chat about.
janine, we are all looking
September 3, 2010 - 5:42pm — betty2020janine, we are all looking forward to it and you are so brave leaving without your laptop and mobile! Have an awesome time on your holiday and share with us your experiences when you return...xoxo
only one way to go...Forward (tm?)
Have an awesome holiday Janine!!!
August 31, 2010 - 11:29pm — mortyNo laptop or mobile?!? I'm jealous. =)
These appear to be the most
August 30, 2010 - 5:04pm — betty2020These appear to be the most dangerous of all Narcissist. I want to thank you for bringing this to the attention of our forum members and it appears we need to provide much more information on this type of narcissist. We now have an excellent resource with Janine to help those out there that are unsure of what type you are dealing with. If anyone out there is confused that some of the patterns and behaviors dont align with the common Narc species, let me know and we can address this with her in greater details. I am certain that our responses to this type is somewhat different that the typical Narc. We will be addressing this in far greater detail on the board and thank you again for all you guidance janine. xoxo
Betty
only one way to go...Forward (tm?)
exactly
September 2, 2010 - 3:55pm — alma25Thank you for sharing.It's a really dangerous type. It would be great to have more information about it.
A.
The N/P I was with looked
August 30, 2010 - 7:06pm — JanetThe N/P I was with looked like a gentle hippie (dreadlocks) peace signal bumper sticker; sometimes attending Quaker Meeting because of his (2) years at a Quaker school; would attend a protest supporting (didn't matter). It was so confusing, he seemed like such a sweet, funny guy - that's what others saw - and me too. His actions were very often exceptionally cruel to me and uncaring to his son. It took a long time of NC for me to really see what a cunning, status and money hungry person he is. He is with the estranged granddaughter of a billionaire right now trying (I am sure) with all his might to make a connection. Bad guy.
Peace. J
This is my N exactly and not
September 2, 2010 - 3:21pm — gigi9This is my N exactly and not only the most dangerous type but I believe the most invalidating of the types because they do not show their asses to anyone in the outside world. Leaving everyone to believe that he is "such a nice guy" and making you look totally crazy. The only validation possible with this type is with the next supply who sees him for who he truly is while in relationship with him. Otherwise.....forget it and even then...validation in this sense only comes if you can track down an ex or new future supply who can validate your experience. This type of N looks like the most charitable, loving, compassionate, kind soul to the world. Leaving only his supply in the wake who has experienced his true self. Yet the supply is so bewildered by what has happened that one is left truly believing it is TOTALLY YOU who is crazy. And wondering why such a compassionate soul would have anything to do with a crazy like you. As a result....most supply in this case, after D&D, walk away, tail between legs taking full blame and responsibility for the demise of the relationship. This also keeps the supply in this case returning when the N resurfaces b/c "Wow" this wonderful N forgives us! Disgusting and totally totally creepy. This has caused my healing to be so much more difficult. I wish I did have the type of N who has showed his ass to many others out in the world. Mine is as disguised as they come and a very successful marital counselor to go along with it. The other day my friend was telling me about a movie she wanted to see...a psychological thriller and I emphatically responded that I would in no way watch a psychological thriller again as I lived it for 3 years with this covert disgusting piece of shit! And to explain this type of relationship to anyone is impossible. It is as if I was locked in a room, mind fucked, spun around a million times, mind fucked some more....and then let out of the room looking crazed and confused to the world while, not knowing what had happened, not being able to explain to anyone what had happened all while being told what a wonderful husband I had! And while the world looked at my husband with a "poor you" "you have to put up with her" look on their faces. And advising him as well that he deserved so much more! WTF! His counselor went as far to say that I needed to get help and to get on meds!!!!!! WTF! No one in his life knows the truth about him. NO ONE. Cannot get more invalidating than that. And I say IN HIS LIFE....supply is out there that is now out of his life. The one I talked to validated my exact experience. I am NC 11 weeks and my eyes are opened more and more. There is a big difference in the types of Ns....but they all have one thing in common....they are pieces of shit.
The "Nice Guy"
September 3, 2010 - 1:33pm — Susan32The ex-Psych professor attempted to be the Nice Guy, but he did an appalling job with keeping the mask on. One of his fellow professors went to graduate school with him at the University of Virginia, and this professor always had a mortified look in his presence. It's like "I have to deal with THAT brat again???" His colleagues avoided him, his students despised him... yet he wanted to come across as the nice, vulnerable vegetarian.
"If you can track down an ex who can validate your experience"-In their own ways, the ex-P's colleagues were the ones who validated my experience. Thru my friends, I learned how they didn't trust him. Some of them quite clearly advised me to steer clear of him (they must be relieved, as am I, to NOT be married to him!!!) My senior essay advisor referred to the ex-P as "different"--it sounded like he wanted to say more, but was too polite to do so. Even my therapist at the time said he was a SICK man (and she was his colleague)
It was a couple of years after the D&D and I found an essay by the ex-P in which he used his first footnote to bash people-by name-for "criticizing my original wording." They had helped him with editing, and he lashed out at them.
I don't think the ex-P hates women. I don't think the ex-P hates me. I don't have to take it personally. He hates happiness and humanity... NOT MY FAULT.
it's my type too
September 2, 2010 - 3:48pm — alma25All the people were asking me after the last D&D, what did I do to make him leave, he was so nice and great and caring.
It's the most difficult because only you know the truth and you feel like the crazy one, bad one.He is so caring and you're a cold bitch who wants too much.It's impossible to explain how terrible it is when you're blaming yourself cause he's saint. Mine is very active in charity for children. He organizes big events, collect things for them and his slogan is: Life is not only for taking...
And I'm a cold lawyer who decided to get him out of my life and why? no one knows!
My friend was the only one who saw who he really was. She told me:he is a bad guy and he is even worse cause he is acting in white gloves.
It's just like a perfect crime. Only the victim knows what's hapenning. No proves, no witnesses, no body. Cause it's not the body that dies, it's a soul.
Funny thing but even when he was writting something to hurt me as much as he could at the end he added: have a nice day:) or have a nice evening:)
So nice, don't you think?
this type is dangerous indeed
September 2, 2010 - 4:29pm — jen79I am still struggling with this, though it is my fault, I need to stop googling him, I am still looking for something to come up against him like the tiger woods scandal.
I am honestly wondering why no other supply freaks out and talks up. In the media it is everywhere how awsome he is and so decent and genuine, and how many good friends he has and they are all so understanding.
In his interviews he portraits a man that you would not ever think of that he is the way he is. Not ever.
I ask myself how is this possible, are these women all stupid? Gullible or am I? I mean it is hard enough to deal with friends and family, but what if a whole media thing is convinced that he is a great guy.
It maked me doubt myself, it must have been me, like there is a magic key to his heart that everyone else has entry to - just not me.
I mean I spent a year or so to get him noticing me as a human being, just one decent human reaction I wanted, a normal concersation, a genuine talk, I could have lived with the idea that he didnt just love me and didnt see a future for us. But thats not it. It is this cruel I am using you no matter what, when I feel convenient, and I withhold any sort of human affection from you, nor do I induldge to any decent talk.
What is this ladies? It seems I was the exception. How is this possible "friends" of 20 years are talking about him as if he is the messiah.
I dont know if I create bad karma this way, but I wish that his new tv show really messes up.
alma and gigi
September 2, 2010 - 4:21pm — terriAre your stories posted? I'd really like to read them and compare notes. Most of what I'm reading here are about Ns that were blatantly cheating jerks. Mine was not like that so I've been confused as to whether he is a narc or not. On top of that, he's done such a good job with projecting that he has me questioning if I was the one who caused all the problems. I go back and forth with this daily.
Gigi, when you wrote about how they make you feel like it's all your fault that the relationship ended, then when they contact you, you're so relieved that they forgive you - I've totally experienced that. I've stood my ground pretty effectively - not so much at first, but getting stronger and more determined each week. He's stop contacting me too since I'm not buying into his games anymore.
I think I'm going to print out your story and take it to my therapist to say "this is what I'm trying to say to everyone and just don't know how - no one seems to believe me." And, of course, the Ns count on the fact that we don't want to go around to everyone and talk about our personal problems so there secrets are safe until we finally have enough and tell the world what jerks they are. I'm at that stage now and that's another reason he's keeping his distance.
terri
September 6, 2010 - 3:43pm — gigi9My story is not posted as it is still coming together for me and I cannot possibly figure out how to put it into words without turning it into an actual book! I am 3 months NC and finally coming to terms with this abuse. I took the blame for EVERYTHING and that is hogwash! He was the most abusive person to date that I have ever had in my life and I cannot even describe it or him! He was a master gaslighter I can tell you that much. Leaving me wondering and convinced at times that I was the one who owed him the apolgy and not the other way around! Hogwash! Someday....I know I will post the story. I just don't know where to begin.....